206 replies to this topic

[Mynemesis]

Before I continue...

I would like to set the record straight that I started this thread by simply put my own views on 'frontosa locations'
If you read my post carefully you will see that not once I have:
- Criticised frontosa (the beautiful fish itself).
- Criticised frontosa keepers.

I'd also like to say that I’m not here to have a go with member fish-lips, i don't even know or have meet the guy but he seems to be the only person that jump on this thread to have a say and most importantly 'stay on topic' with me (thanks), which understandably make it look as if we're having crack at each other. This was not my intention.
A lot of posts on this thread have been deleted due to personal attacks among members, again I’d like to apologise for what I’ve started may have caused a bit of an up roar. Some of the attacks were directly at me they didn't bother me one bit, I didn’t report them, and none of mine posts was deleted.

Now,

fish-lips wrote: Kapampa and Moba have big differences in colour so the collection points are diffrent.

If you read my post again you will see that I have used Kapapa and Moba as an ‘example’ to ask member apistovits confirm if correct when:

A fish collected at location ‘A’ but being boxed/shipped from location ‘B’ then they will call them sp. ‘location B’

The answer was: Correct/Yes.

So in the example (note I have explicitly mention ‘example’) you can see that a Kapampa might well in fact a Moba that was boxed or shipped from Kapampa.

Based on Ted Judy (which I don’t know who this person is but I hope Apistovits can fill me in) [see above]

Would it be fair to say ‘for example’ that Kalumba, Kapampa, Kitumba, Moba, Moliro , Tembwe and so on… were collected from only one or two locations and being boxed/shipped from a different place hence there variant names?

[Hypanheaven]

Sounds like your either jealous or you cant afford them your self, and to be fair you were having a go at them, you were telling them how to spend there money, and you said "Ps. Regards to cert, did u know there is a program call photoshop?"
that basically calling them liars

Edited by Hypanheaven, 12 June 2012 - 10:46 PM.

[Mynemesis]

and you said "Ps. Regards to cert, did u know there is a program call photoshop?"
that basically calling them liars

No Hypanheaven.

All goods come to Australia required a Certificate of Origin. If your fish come from Singapore/Taiwan/Thailand then you will need to certify from the exporter that your fish come from that country. If your fish came from Germany then to Singapore then to Australia you still have to declare that your fish came from Germany.

It is a valid reason for me to raise the ‘photoshop’ point because anyone with the skill/software can do it but faking a COO is against the law.

[Mynemesis]

werdna wrote: Jun 11 2012, 11:52 AM:
What does it matter what they are called?

It’s matter because if different locations had been sold at different price and buyers need to know whether or not they’ve got what they’ve paid for. As a buyer I would like to know the true about my fish if possible.


When a fish label as wild caught you can either take the importers word for it or ask the importer for a ‘Certificate of Origin’ that issued by the exporters and NOT from the importer himself/herself.


Did anyone actually look and study the maps and link given on previous post?

On this one (given on previous post) shown Zongwe (Chumbu) on the WEST COAST OF THE LAKE

http://www.frontosa.com/images/map.swf


And on this one on frontosa.com.au when member ‘davo/Administrator’ asked for help for an update map of frontosa collection points and member frontosa.lover (aka fishking123) found another map that shown:


Zongwe (Chumbu) on the EAST COAST OF THE LAKE

http://frontosa.com....?showtopic=4646


If you looking at Google’s map it actually shown that Chumbu as a desert located near Lake Malawi.

So where EXACTLY IS CHUMBU?

The post below and been pinned and locked. If the certificate proof enough for you that\'s fine but if you would like to know more details then a ‘Certificate of Origin’ FROM THE EXPORTER and NOT the importer is your proof.

http://www.perthcich...showtopic=47491

Again for those that show interest (1,771 views so far) on this thread, I’ve started this thread directed at NO ONE in particular. This thread is just my views on frontosa locations and you have your rights to feel whatever way you like to ward me but please stay on track and not to spam it with personal attacks.

Edited by Mynemesis, 17 June 2012 - 12:40 PM.

[Buccal]

Something that's being a little over looked here is that fronts are harem fish that have genetic traits within the harem. Because subtle differences can be seen from one collected group to another doesn't nessesarily mean it is a different location. A harem fish means there is a Alfa male with 10-30 semi- loyal females that stay close and form a breeding group. Occasionally females may swap harems. This is how distinct subtle differences occur from a natural form of line breeding in a way. Now, 20 meters down the lake still in the same location will be another harem of fish, and these will show differences again. I've seen many discussions on forums around the world saying that Moba and Tembwe are collected from the same location. So as a example, if a group of Tembwe wild caught was ordered and received then another order eight months later of Tembwe again, there would be subtle differences because they are taken from a different harem.
Slight gentic changes occur from line breeding and environmental factors, that's all this really is. As we all know the three definite major differences are Burundi, Moba and seven bar.

[fishking123]

very true dave.. its all about trust

Edited by fishking123, 17 June 2012 - 02:48 PM.

[alan0901]

I bought the Chumbu from the same importer that Dave uses. I didn't ask for the COO from the importer because he's well known in Australia for his reputation for services and quality of his fish he imports. So I trust him on that.
In term he trust his importer he uses in Germany
Do I know where the fish was collected from? Well, I presume they were collected from Zongwe. I hope they are anyway.
Do I know or care why they don't called Chumbu Zongwe instead? I wouldn't care less about that. Maybe they named it Chumbu because it was the diver's name or they just wanted to sound different so they can make more ppls interested?
Who knows? I don't have time to make calls to Congo and ask the diving teams who named it. You may say that's like throwing money away not knowing exactly every bit of details about my fish I got in my tank. But If I can afford to do that as well as
sending my kid to private schools for their education. Then is my choice.

[Buccal]

Absolutely fishlips and Alan, as fishlips said earlier on in the discussion, tropheus are a similar example to frontosa collecting. If one wants to specialize in a species of fish, there's nothing wrong with that.

[bigjohnnofish]

hmmm dont know much about fronties as i dont find them attractive in any particular way... but to me it sounds like we have a lot of hybrid fronties!!! hybridization obviously occurs in the wild then by what i've read in this dicussion... ?????

feel free to hang crap on me!!! im a big boy - i can handle it.... lol...

[moo]

i dont see how there so rare it seems every one i meet has them i love them dave needs them but i dont justify getting them till we can afford them and be sure they will be happy in saying that if you have the money to splurge on this greatly expensive fish why not, it is truely beautiful and ive seen some really ugly fish that people pay stupid amounts for and im just like WHYYYYY! but each to there own..

and you cant say save your money for you kids education and not expect to offend anyone just coz you have kids doesnt mean you cant have nice things and if i had kids id much prefer them to watch some fancy fronty rather than a fancy big screen tv that everyone has in there house

[waxy]

Cmon guys even I can see the difference between different types of frontosa and Ive never even owned one.
Kipili and mobas being my favourite so far.

P.S The black widow looks horrible.

Edited by waxy, 08 July 2012 - 08:17 AM.

[Conda]

P.S The black widow looks horrible.

yes it is ugly .......

[fishking123]

haha i with you 100% kipilli are my best



so true

[Mynemesis]

I'm not sure why this is an issue, or even a thread.

Why not?

[bigjohnnofish]

If you had 10 separate tanks next to each other with 10 diffrent types you can see the diffrence come around sometime and see my many colonies to see the diffrence

hahaha i wanna come over dave and while your in the next room im gonna swap a few fronties from tank to tank to tank to tank.... and then sit back and watch to see if you can find which ones i swapped and return them to their own kind!!!! LMAO !!! better bring a carton - prob gonna take a while

[Bowdy]

Hehehehe ^^^^ maybe a keg and a swag johno

[Mynemesis]

This is a very good discussion and very good points have been made but this will not stop me buy diffrent strains of this species this means I have to keep collecting more new ones,there is no right and wrong here as know one knows the truth about any fish that is collected all we can do is make sure the collectors are doing the right thing by us,if I found a new fishing spot I would not tell anyone as I know every man and his dog will be there next day.trust is the key here

very true dave.. its all about trust

sorry mod i have to quote the lot in this particular instance!


Oh now you guys saying it's all come down to trust? So you CAN NOT tell us where Chumbu is?





I think i can now have the last laugh!













Speaking of trust,

Would you trust an importer when he/she

1. Can't prove to you the true location of the fish.
2. Can't show you the REAL CO

Edited by Mynemesis, 13 August 2012 - 09:02 AM.

[fishking123]

jeez we are not asking you to get any fish but i can buy what ever i want if i found a reeealy good fishing spot with some super cool fish i will not tell any one where i get them!
yeah its all about trust. i dont know ravi that well but i trust him for wc fish.