19 replies to this topic

[Eejay]

Hey guys I have a mate who had just got into fish keeping. They have decided to have fish from both America and Africa. Personally I think it is stupid to mix fish with totally different requirements etc. what does everyone think??

[Mattymak]

Can be okay with certain fish

I don't like to mix the different area'd fish but each to their own..

[TheTexasCichlidMasacre]

i did it once when i didnt know any better... i found with the african ones i had in there they kinda schooled together and tried to tag team my Pair of nicks some of them would have a go at the nics from the front while the others snuck up behind and he ended up with his beautiful long pointed tip of his fin had been chewed off but 2 days later he obviously had enough of it as i found 2 africans dead in the morning... the thing was my male nic was very placid... never fought with any fish i ever kept with him until i put in some some pseudotropheus fish... the male nic would never leave his cave until the house was dark... hated lights even just room lights being on.... but these africans were going into his cave and tag teaming him it wasnt a fight but more the nic just decided he had enough and sorted out the problem...

but yeah i had 2 peacocks in there 2 and the nic let them stay in his cave with them all the time but once i put the female nic in that i bought the 2 peacocks and some 3 inch firemouths were all dead!

gotta take into consideration that the substrate spawners dont have the added feature of being able to keep the eggs in their mouth so they will be aggresively defending them...

well just some ideas for ya

[Scales]

What's a nic?

[sandgroper]

Nicaragua cichlids maybe.

[TheTexasCichlidMasacre]

Hypsophrys Nicaraguensis in perth we seem to call them parrot cichlids other common names mccaw cichlid, nicaraguan cichlid.

they are my favourite cichlid, but atm i dont have any i have 2 green texas and 2 convicts.. decided to try out some other fish for once. I am really loving the texas

[scotty81]

I have a mixed tank, they all get along pretty well. Might have been lucky

[Buccal]

If your going to mix them, as I also have, the bigger the tank the better.
You must have a large well seeded filter.
Best to collect all different types as juveniles to grow out together.
Buy two or three of each type, and as they grow and females show, get rid of all females, so the breeding process doesn't take place.
It's a must that you really over crowd your tank to the max with fish.
Over crowding stops particular individuals being singled out.
Every one gets their turn at being picked on by the dominants, and each confrontation is always short lived.
Keep all fish well fed to reduce aggression.
This set up will need plenty of water changes and filter cleans.
These type set ups are a hive of activity and even draw the attention of non-fish keepers.

[Mattymak]

Nothing wrong with breeding in there as long as you don't plan on selling the fry they will most probably get eaten anyway

Unless you're worries about the aggression when breeding?

[TheTexasCichlidMasacre]

have you seen how agro and territorial those americans get when breeding, and if the tank is over crowded that would make the breeding aggression worse imho so all males sounds good to me lol

[Mattymak]

Yeah I have lol

[Buccal]

With any American in this mixture of fish, they must not be able to pair or bond, or it's all over.
The only two fish I'd say stay away from is paratilapia pollini and buttercoferi.
Spelling may be bit off with the latter mentioned slang (hornet fish).
Obviously peacock bass and alike stay away from to for a mixed continent fish tank.

[bigjohnnofish]

i have seen it and it seems to work very well.... follow buccal's advice and you'll be well on the way to a nice display tank...

[Buccal]

Cheers Johnno.
It is perfectly normal to lose one here and there while balancing things out.
If one spends a few years doing this, the style of the aquarium is original and interesting to extreme.
Neither does one get board of their fish needing to change the types they have as the interest n excitement from the challenge of combining inhabitance literally lasts forever.

Just looking back to the beginning of this thread, it was stated, (mixing fish with different requirements).
A Ph of 7.6 as usually is from a tap with medium hardness will do fine for just about any fish you find in a shop.
What people fail to realize is that these fish are so far domesticated and bred in captivity that they have adapted to the parameters of our avaliable water.
I straight out use tap water in my breed room.
Stingrays, Malawi, tangs, Americans, Madagascans and other African tributaries all breed in same water.
Note.. (only shop sales not to public for business ethical reasons except stingrays)
All suburbs should have close enough water parameters give or take to do the same job.
But as Johnno said, some areas may briefly have ammonia at periodical maintenance times.

Edited by Buccal, 17 January 2013 - 09:31 AM.

[Scales]

In my experience over crowding is the best way to go in a setup like this, it exponentially cuts down the aggression. Over stocking s tank isn't a problem as long as you over filtrate your system both with media and water flow as there is a lot of waste being produced.

Buccal I love reading your posts, descriptive and clear and makes learning or expanding on current knowledge all the easier

[Mattymak]

I agree Clay, I have my tank filled with a good amount of fish so one can't really be targeted by an aggressor as they get distracted by other fish. =]

[Buccal]

In my experience over crowding is the best way to go in a setup like this, it exponentially cuts down the aggression. Over stocking s tank isn't a problem as long as you over filtrate your system both with media and water flow as there is a lot of waste being produced.

Buccal I love reading your posts, descriptive and clear and makes learning or expanding on current knowledge all the easier

Thanks for the kind words mrdk, yes over filtrating is needed,
This is why I have really focused on the K medias.
The K medias are 100% biological and never change in the way of clogging and lessening in performance.
A simple little debris collection tray with a fine collection screen or media can go under the water spout coming out of the K1 media bio sump or overhead tub.
There is no circular flow action to the tank with this method, so two 5w power heads spaced evenly breaking the surface is all and more of what's needed.
The collection screen can be thoroughly cleaned with a cheap high pressure cleaner from bunnings.
The tumbling action in the K media always keeps debris coming out in fine particles.
To reduce constant maintenance, make up 4-5 mechanical screens and keep them in a foam esky box.
And pull out a new one every time it needs changing.
High pressure clean all spent screens at the end of month or two months.
Even quality canister filters half way to maintenance time are only operating at a fraction of their ability and this is where the damage occurs to the weaker fish in a designed crowded environment.
With canister use with a intended over crowding situation, given that one is adamant on using canisters, three small canisters should be used that add up to the size needed.
This way every third week one can be cleaned and large surface areas are always free enough inside canisters to hold sufficient numbers of beneficial bacteria at a constant average.

[bigjohnnofish]

i got a bio something or rather filter box the other week off ollie... completely new design and well thought out giving maximum surface area exposure and flow... highly recommended... above tank/pond filter box only requires small pump to operate the filter box and the pump can be placed at the top or midwater to get maximum water flow...ideal for glass bottom tank buster tank! .... no dead spots as the fish basically move all the water around along with the waterflow created by the water exiting the filter box....

a quick one for you buccal... how much k media do you think you need to replace your current sump ???

[Buccal]

I'm going to replace half to begin with.
So at the moment I'm cycling 40 liters worth, to go into sump soon.
Maybe 100 liters needed all up.
There is 90 liters or so activating my female ray pen.
Eventually on my display tank I will stand upright two lengths of 150mm PVC pipe with bottoms endcapped.
They will have K media in with water from tank injected in at the bottom of upright pipes.
A medium air stone at bottom of each for tumbling K media..
Water will return out top through a 150mm elbow.
A gutter guard screen at top near water exit will stop the K media exiting.

[Mattymak]

Strong filtration, and dither fish, you should be ok to mix