27 replies to this topic

[kassysimon]

OK, this is about my 10ft planted tank again.

I have been to the Seachem website and I have read their "suggested" 7 day dose guide for a planted tank. And they even say that it is just a guide and experimentation is required to get the best results.

From that guide, i have totalled the weekly cost to dose a 10ft tank, based on 1000 litres and at a 2 litre bottle per product cost of $80.00. (ebay and online stores). See attachment.

Now this comes to $29.50 per week.

Is this what i can expect this tank to cost with your experiences in fertilising and maintaining the correct levels of minerals? In addition to lighting and CO2?

I dont want to cop out and settle for your run of the mill cichlid tank but I'm a little disheartened by the costs that are building up. Or am I being unrealistic in thinking that a tank this size wouldn't cost so much?

How much would you say that you spend on your tanks fertilisers and mineral additives?


Thanks

Simon.

[Craig]

No way, you can do it WAY cheaper. Look into EI dosing, and making your own fert mixes. Good idea to speak to Oli at Aquotix and do some research on the Barr Report

[kassysimon]

Cheers. Will do.

[Hypanheaven]

I fert with Dino pee from aqua green and my plants love it, this is only $18 for half a liter, it's quiet strong so I only need 20 drops for my 550L tank a day and it's heavily planted. Example is my first Dino pee bottle was a 125ml and it lasted me 8 weeks

[kassysimon]

Thanks.

Edited by kassysimon, 29 December 2011 - 03:56 PM.

[kassysimon]

I fert with Dino pee from aqua green and my plants love it, this is only $18 for half a liter, it's quiet strong so I only need 20 drops for my 550L tank a day and it's heavily planted. Example is my first Dino pee bottle was a 125ml and it lasted me 8 weeks

Thanks.

Do you use anything else in addition to Dino Pee?

I checked out EI dosing as suggested earlier and Aqua Green also sell the required minerals. Have you tried this also?

Thanks

[Mr_docfish]

No way, you can do it WAY cheaper. Look into EI dosing, and making your own fert mixes. Good idea to speak to Oli at Aquotix and do some research on the Barr Report

If you have a range of products in mind, let me know and Ill tailor make it to suit your needs - or I can advise a regime for you.

Cheers
Oliver

[kassysimon]

So ive done a bit more research on DIY fertilisers and have found a calculator here http://www.thenutrie...um/calculators/

it seems too easy to be true but when comparing it to others, i found them all rather similar, such as http://www.theplante...k.co.uk/EI.html Its just very daunting when everyone talks about KNo3 this and KH2PO4 that.....

Anyways.....is this the sort of thing you guys had in mind?

Thanks

Oh and Oliver..I would love to hear your thoughts on the above as you have been mentioned quite a bit so im thinking you are the most knowledgeable on this, and in regards to your offer of a regime, What do you have in mind?

Thanks

[Hypanheaven]

Dino pee is the only thing I fert, the phosphates come from fish poo/food

[Graeme]

Ollie is very helpful and does understand planted tanks.

He can help you no matter what way you would choose to go about it.

My suggestion, go EI.
It really is easy ( I can do it lol ) and the most efficient way I think for $$$$

Just use all tank water onto your lawn, plants etc


Graeme

[Rovik]

In an established aquarium with the right balance of fish to plants:

You do not need to add phosphorous or Nitrogen.

*Phosphorous (Usually in the form of phosphates (PO4 3-) comes from the "binders" in fish food.
*Nitrogen (Usually in the form of nitrates (NO3-)) comes from fish food as a result of filter bacteria consuming ammonia.

Beware that this is ideal if you have the right balance of fish to plants.
For example if one week I lack phosphates & nitrates, ill just feed the fish more bloodworm or food.

If you Dont want to have lots of fish,Or your plants are consuming it too fast, Just dose with:

*KNO3 (Nitrate Component/ potassium is also used by plants) - also cheap and inexpensive. (available at Aquotix)

*NaH2PO4 aka Monobasic sodium phosphate, (Phosphate Component) - Also known as pH Down powder, more readily available than KH2PO4 (and cheaper)...You dont need much to obtain say 1ppm of phosphate, don't worry about the sodium element, as sodium is has a very low atomic mass. (probably more sodium in tap-water.) (available at Aquotix)

All you really need to add, if you have enough nitrate and phosphate (fish) is :

*Light
*Carbon (CO2 injection for lush and fast growth or liquid supplement)

*Potassium
*Iron
*GH supplement (Including magnesium and calcium) **Depending on your tap water**
*KH supplement **Depending on your tap water**
*Trace elements

(once again, all available at Aquotix most of which are dry salts)
Aquotix is the only stockists of AquaREALm, a CHEAP, high quality brand of various aquarium supplements and fertilisers.

The great Mr_Docfish aka Ollie will help you out.

[Rovik]

Light and CO2 have and close relationship.

For example if you are going to have high light e.g. metal halides or T5 HO tubes, the demand for Nutrients and CO2 increases.
So if you are going to have vast amounts of light you have to balance this high light out with more CO2, More nutrients and so onto avoid algae blooms.

The result of this "High Tech" system with high light, CO2, and nutrients is lush and very fast plant growth with little algae given all parameters are kept regular.

But as light increases, so does demand for nutrients. Plants grow faster and use up things faster so you will have a more strict fertiliser regime to keep algae at bay and keep all nutrients of supply for the plants.

If you choose medium to lower light lighting options you can get away with a medial regime and avoid CO2 (Lower light, lower demand for CO2). But you sacrifice the speed of plant growth. Either way you will still have to dose with various nutrients But not the same speed.

All depends on how committed your are and how much spare time you have available to tinker with water parameters.
As said above, EI method is much less time consuming than the PPI method if you are going a High light tank, Which i recommend.
Its Slightly more work but much more rewarding.

Good luck.
Rovik

Edited by Rovik, 29 December 2011 - 08:53 PM.

[Westie]

The great Mr_Docfish aka Ollie will help you out.

Is this your way of asking for a pay rise?

[Mr_docfish]

Oh and Oliver..I would love to hear your thoughts on the above .....What do you have in mind?

Well Rovik has said everything that needs to be known (clever fella aint he?) and the main point is I need to know what type of water you have (levels of Ca, Mg and KH etc) and what type of plants you are considering and from that I can recommend the right fert routine using commercial products or from the AquaRealm range. The good thing is I know what is in the AquaRealm products, and extra bits a pieces can be added individually in case there is a deficiency of any sort, such as Fe, NO3, PO4, Ca etc....

Bring a sample of water in, let me test it out, and Ill get back to you with a tailor made routine that will suit your situation.

[kassysimon]

Well Rovik has said everything that needs to be known (clever fella aint he?) and the main point is I need to know what type of water you have (levels of Ca, Mg and KH etc) and what type of plants you are considering and from that I can recommend the right fert routine using commercial products or from the AquaRealm range. The good thing is I know what is in the AquaRealm products, and extra bits a pieces can be added individually in case there is a deficiency of any sort, such as Fe, NO3, PO4, Ca etc....

Bring a sample of water in, let me test it out, and Ill get back to you with a tailor made routine that will suit your situation.

Its a done deal!

Thanks

[kassysimon]

Thanks!

Just a few questions then.


[quote
For example if one week I lack phosphates & nitrates, ill just feed the fish more bloodworm or food.

[/quote]

How do i know if i lack phosphates & nitrates? Is a test kit available or just by observation?

In regards to the CO2, i will be using it once my tank is in its final resting position which wont be for about 6 months time (building a new house) but in the meantime i was planing on the sugar and yeast DIY version or Seachems liquid form as i only have a small amount of plants and fish at the moment.


So, i will be taking the EI, high light, CO2 route. Just need to get down to see Ollie with a sample of water and go from there.

Thanks alot.

[Neakit]

Hey just a thought, if you have to worry about the cost of a tank should you set it up?

[kassysimon]

Hey just a thought, if you have to worry about the cost of a tank should you set it up?

Hey, just a thought, but helpful post were the norm here until your recent post.

In these times saving money is on most peoples minds. There is no need to waste money if there are alternatives that reap the same rewards.

No one here mentioned any concern about the cost of running a tank. Just that the cost to run a tank by a given guide was to cost a certain amount.

Hey, just a thought, but negative comments are usually all you post so try reading the full thread prior to posting a comment, but hey, its just a thought.

[Brett]

Lots of good info here, just a few quick comments.

EI is an elegant solution, but that is a lot of water changing in a 1000l tank. You would want an efficient system or its going to get old fast.

Finding the "balance" between fish and plants sounds easy, but in reality it is always a moving target as you switch around fish and plants or even just the growth of them.

You could "feed the tank", but that is an expensive way to add nitrogen and phosphorus to the tank although it does reduce the need for micronutrients (personally I rely on the substrate to provide micronutrients)

When deciding whether you want to go for "maximal growth", I think you should always consider how much pruning you want to do. If weekly pruning is not going to fit into your life then a system with more modest nutrient levels (and hence growth) may be worth considering.

Cheers
Brett

[Anka]

Simon, I find that while most people on the forum are friendly and helpful there is a small handful that like to exercise their elitism.

I find it is best to ignore those kinds of people.