[ofishyfish]

Hi

I lost one of my malaysian Discus this morning, anyone got any ideas on what could have killed him as i am worried about other fish, Personally I thought it was stress as he was the one that always go t picked on and he was looking sad for a week or so ie his peppering looked worse. I isollated him yesterday in a hosp tank and gave him a salt bath, he seemed to be having laboured breathing as in the end he was hanging out near the sponge filter output. He was having trouble swimming and was going allover the place.
His gills looked very light. This is a photo of him after he passed. All other fish in tank seem ok and tank parameters were good ph 6.5 nitrate 0.5 ammonia 0 temp 29
Poor luv RIP

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[Kieran]

Sorry for your loss mate. We can only really hypothesise as the the cause now, but there are a few common things that may have been the issue. Many discus keepers will agree that every group has a 'runt' at the bottom of the pecking order, that unfortunately often eventually succumbs to stress-related illnesses, unless a sufficiently large group of discus is kept.

If bullying is the case in your discus tank, then the problem will only get worse now that there is one less discus, so I have a couple of questions:
What size tank were the discus kept in? (the 215L or the 1000L)
How many discus were kept there?
What were the other tankmates, if any?
How long have you had the discus?
How long has the tank & filtration been running?
What have you been feeding the discus?
What size water changes have you been doing and how often?
What kind of flow rate do you have in the setup? (fast, medium, stagnant etc.)
Is the tank in an area of high pedestrian traffic or activity?

I remember you had a little trouble a few weeks ago with sick discus, by any chance would this be the one of the same?
I also remember you had 4 adult discus in august after some ammonia troubles? I'm glad you're still at it as discus are beautiful fish and the favourite out of all of mine

Hopefully if we can work out a couple of likely causes of death, then the newbie discus keepers who read this unfortunate thread will learn something from your experiences.

Kind Regards,
Kieran

[ofishyfish]

he was kept in my 215L tank and he was the shy one out of the other tank mates when it was feeding time he would often run to the back of the tank and face the back wall.



ok here we go

How many discus were kept there? 4 adult and 2 juveniles
What were the other tankmates, if any? all others are fine including tetras and loaches
How long have you had the discus? have had him since July i think and he has been sick n the past was the one i got the vet out to see back in august. has been fine since though and all others havebeen ok since the ammonia prob i had which was awhile ago now.
How long has the tank & filtration been running? tank is rougly been going for 10 months
What have you been feeding the discus? mixed diet of brine shimp discus deluxe, beef heart abd sera pellets
What size water changes have you been doing and how often? i do 10- 20 % each week
What kind of flow rate do you have in the setup? (fast, medium, stagnant etc.) i have a drip system that is medium
Is the tank in an area of high pedestrian traffic or activity? it is in the family room so yes.

[Kieran]

Hmmm okay. I had one like that once. Poor little juvi who was the runt until I got more discus.

I'm inclined to say that if you kept him alone he may have been even more stressed. It's a lose-lose situation unfortunately. But that also depends on the discus. I've had one that would freak if left by himself overnight, they really are social creatures, and the best thing I've found is a group of at least 6 at a bare minimum, but the more the better. With that 1000L tank of yours you could have a really amazing discus community and they would do much better than in the 215L.

I applaud you for having a decent sized tank for discus with the 1000L one. I wish more discus keepers had the same dedication as you.

Unfortunately if you now have 5 (?) left, the bullying will get worse and a new one will more than likely become the runt.

[Tropo]

Hi there

I tend to agree with Kieren I have a dicus/ community tank 17 discus 20+ other fish in a 6x2x2 and yes there will always be one that gets picked on. Isolating discus can be just as detremantal as treating them they like to be in a group. And stress seems to be there biggest killer. Peppering as far as I know is the hybrid form of stress bars ie pigeon bloods, mellons etc yet this can be normal but you say it got worse is a good indication of stress. If there wasn't any other signs of illness I wouldn't get to concerned if other fish are happy let them be. I do 50% water changes at least every nine days, run double filtration and maintain my ph at least 7.0 low ph is fine for wild caught but remember asian bred discus are in a ph of 7.5+. A lot of people say discus will only breed at low ph but mine have at 7+. There are a lot of factors that could have caused your discus's death but if all your others are healthy I wouldn't concern yourself to much sometimes it just happens. If this happens again try feeding some live black worm as I have done this before and seen them bounce straight out of it otherwise clout or metro is some good meds to start with.
Hope this helps if you want any more info feel free to send me a pm....
Tropo

[ofishyfish]

thanks for your help guys, I wish I had just left him in the main tank now not seperated him cause I think I made him worse. I did move him over concern for the others.

I need to find some more adult discus, as I only have three 3 adults and 2 Juveniles and 3 really juveniles.

If anyone knows of anyone selling some nice fish please let me know and Ill try to not kill them :-(

[tha_krust]

i say, yes there will always be one at the bottom of the pecking order, when he dies there will be another to take his place. i also say ,you can never de-worm your fish enough. i de-worm my discus on a monthly basis...atleast.
giving your discus live foods always helps..but usually with discus by the time you notice that there is a problem its already too late. peppering comes a mutated gene from any fish that has a pigeonblood blood line that has had the vetical bars bred out of it...but i think peppering can depend on the fish's environment, substrate, background etc, mood, temp,etc, etc..youve seen my pigeon pearls during the day..in my iside tank they are blue or sometimes orange....in the evening they are pure white..so what i guess i'm saying is that you cant tell a discus's health buy how much peppering they are showing ???

[ofishyfish]

what does every one use to worm on a monthly/ 6 monthlybasis, everyone seems to use pig/poultry wormers. I know Metro is good but i was told by the vet that this can cause fertility problems, so I wouldnt want to use often?

Ive been told to use:
Big L pig wormer
Nilverum pig/poultry

any comments on these?

[dazzabozza]

Gday

Metronidazole is an antibiotic.

Levamisole HCL is the de-wormer aka Big L.

Combining to 2 is handy to offset any damage done by the worms (e.g. tackles bacteria that may have entered open wounds etc).


Daz

[ofishyfish]

sorry my mistake it was metro the vent said not to use it was dmz

[dazzabozza]

A couple of links that may be of use (both a pinned at the top of this forum) -

http://www.perthcichlid.com.au/forum/index...showtopic=28551
http://www.perthcichlid.com.au/forum/index...showtopic=12291

Daz

[sydad]

sorry my mistake it was metro the vent said not to use it was dmz

DMZ (dimetridazole), like metronidazole, is to be regarded as an antibiotic: it is not active against intestinal worms.

What does every one use to worm on a monthly/ 6 monthlybasis, everyone seems to use pig/poultry wormers. I know Metro is good but i was told by the vet that this can cause fertility problems, so I wouldnt want to use often?

Ive been told to use:
Big L pig wormer
Nilverum pig/poultry

any comments on these?

Nilverm (not Nilverum), is a synthetic antibiotic that is active against many parasites. However, it is extremely toxic, and the margin for error in the aquarium is virtually zero. It is far safer to stick with Levamisole.

Syd.

[tha_krust]

Levamisole.