40 replies to this topic

[Dr_Pat]

That looks good...but how do you actually connect the appliances?

Edited by Dr_Pat, 25 January 2011 - 12:24 AM.

[MilkyJoe]

looks like you patch in the pos and neg cables so it would involved cutting and stripping the cable. I believe it will work, for the price you cant really go wrong!.. unless ofcourse it fails in usual cheap chinese crap fashion and ends up freezing/cooking all your fish =/ hmmm

Edited by MilkyJoe, 25 January 2011 - 04:46 PM.

[rx007]

I know a member who uses his double garage as a fish room & has as many tanks as Morley aquariums, he retict everything as flow to waste (no water manual changes) & he heats the room with a gas heater with a thermostat. Gas is best. I think poly would only be good during autum/spring as you don't need much heating during summer.

[Riggers]

what are the power costs involved in running a 10000lt/hr pump? isnt that just as costly as say getting a heater unit from an old spa? could be worth looking into check out these....

http://www.davey.com..._Gas_Heater.pdf
http://www.directpoo...au/prod1290.htm

Edited by Riggertron, 02 June 2011 - 12:20 AM.

[Riggers]

Or if you wanted to go full hippy style, rather than taking the water away to get warm then coming back, which takes a lot of energy, why not use that energy (the sun) to cover the cost of using a system that is far more efficient to heat the water. for example a small solar spa heating unit? these cost around 1000 bucks and are capable of powering a system that warms large volumes of water to 40degrees.....

http://www.ebay.com....=item19c5a6e8d1

[Niz]

what are the power costs involved in running a 10000lt/hr pump?

i have a 10000L pump. It draws 190W, so about $0.86 per day assuming its on 24/7

Edited by Niz, 02 June 2011 - 03:12 AM.

[mattt]

pretty sure our 10,000L/hr runs 110w

[Ivan Sng]

Mattt, are you still running this black poly solar heating?? Is it making a difference in the temperature if so??

[mattt]

nah i needed the pipe for something else and recycled it :0, i dont think it would do much at all in this current weather.

[Riggers]

after a little research i have found out a little more about the solar thing..... for around $1000 you can get a 1.5kw system that will run basically all of your fishy needs (within reason). So far i havent found any other cost effective method that could be used...My thinking is that if it takes X amount of power to run a pump to push water up to a warming system to save Y amount of power on heaters etc, why not set up free energy from the sun to power Y (heaters etc) and anything else you need at an initial cost but nothing thereafter. anyone have any other suggestions for saving power?

[fourdapostle]

wind generator, problem is storing the power I reckon...been looking into this also...1.5kva less than a grand so good value..with the govt rebate going down to 20c a kw not worth feeding back to the grid...

[werdna]

Why is it not worth feeding into the grid?
1) If you get in quick you will still get the 40c rebate if you are lucky
2) If you arent quick and get the 20c you also add the feed-in tariff of 7c, so you get 27c for every kw you send out.
3) You pay 21c per kw, so you are still infront.
4) If you send out to the grid you dont have to pay for storage and maintenance.
5) If you store power, you will end up with less, there is always going to be a loss when you store power.
6) Grid feed inverters have the highest efficiencies you can get on inverters, getting up to 97% efficient.
7) Grid feeds run all panels in series instead of parallel, this means for the same power generated, you have less current flowing through your power cables. Power loss is calculated by I² x R. I=current, R=resistance. So every time you double resistance, power loss quadruples. Copper wire has a resistance, if you want proof, feel thin jumper leads after you jump start a car, that warmth is power being burnt off in heat.

Do a search on wind speeds in your area, or invest in a wind speed monitor and work out your average speed before buying a wind turbine, you may be surprised how little wind you get over the kick in speed.
And a 1.5kw wind turbine only generates that at optimum speed, most people who install them are dissappointed with them.
Be an even bigger waste of resources to buy a wind generator and not get enough wind to generate anything.
They cant just be stuck on the roof either, they need to be up in clear air out of turbulence.
Neighbours tend not to care about solar panels on your roof, they might if you stick a propellor 30m in the air and try to convince them a whirring noise will help them get to sleep.
The blade diameter for a 1.5kw wind turbine is around 3m, that is big!
Even 1.5kw vertical axis turbines have a diameter of around 2m.
They just arent practical in a residential area.

Best investment I have made is a shed out of coolroom panels, I am heating the whole shed with a 400w heater working for 8 hours per day at the moment. Every tank is sitting on ~22 degrees.

If you are keeping African Cichlids drop the temperature on the heaters down to 21-22 degrees, you could be amazed how much power that saves you.
Stick 10mm poly around all your tanks to insulate better against heat loss.

Andrew

[fourdapostle]

with all that andrew, we are only at around 18.19 per kw at the moment, yes to all you say and you would be getting a bit back, but now the heats turning up on the govt, they are backing out of what they first said, because to many are switching to solar...It would be better imo if you could store power for yourself and become self sufficient at a resoanable price, not $20,000...I would prefer solar myself, but the cost out weighs the outlay for me anyway. Alright for you guys who are on an astronomical amount of dosh....
Andrew you know I keep real fish, those that need hot water so to speak, not goldfish like those africans

[werdna]

Typical discus keepers, cant work out how to add 10% gst and stop reading anything past the first line of a newspaper article..
As of July power cost on A1 tariff is nearly 22c per kw.
The govt are backing out of the 40c rebate for new installs, us who got in quick have locked them in under contract for 10 years.

And I dont know where you got the astronomical income from???
I suppose if you dont waste all your money on mongrel fish that need to toughen up it might look that way.

[bigjohnnofish]

when you do the sums on solar in most cases its gonna take 10-20 years to pay for itself.... you still gonna be where you are now in 10-20 years ????? now whos having a re-think ???

[fourdapostle]

I wouldn't say africans are mongrel fish, I would never say that about any fish, they are ok for those that don't want a challenge in life...you just keep going the way you are Andrew, all is well with you...LOL

[Niz]

If you put in a 1.5KW system, and used 100% of the generated power (assuming 7.88 units gernerated a day on average), it would take 3.7 years to break even.

Attached is a calculator in .xls for rough estimates.

Attached Files

•  WA_FiT_ROI_payback_times.xls   10.5KB   11 downloads

Edited by Niz, 05 June 2011 - 03:16 AM.

[Ivan Sng]

I guess the Black Poly idea got changed to Solar PVs instead.

The arguments from both sides about the feasility of having grid connected Solar PV systems is always interesting follow. You can clearly see that some are pro of the idea and some are con of the idea. There are lots of factors that would affect the payback periods such as increase in electricity costs, government doing back-flips, changes in your family circumstances, changes in working arrangements, and the list goes on. As much as you could do your sums, you still cannot be sure that in 10 years time, things are going to be as you estimated in your payback calculations.

I reckon that in 10-20 years time, two things could happen. One is that those who gone in and purchase a solar system would be seens as fools as the paybacks were not as it seems. Or the other would be that those who did not buy a grid connected solar pv system would be blaming themselves for not buying one back then, because the energy company has stopped any further connection to the grid. So who has a crystal ball??

There will always be two sides of the argument regardless. I think the uncertainty and the both sides arguments are similar to purchasing or not purchasing numerous properties in Perth in 2003/2004, with one side thinking "well Perth prices should soar shortly, let buy some real estate while it is still cheap" and the one side thinking "Where's is WA again? Who wants to buy there?".

[werdna]

ummm, where did you get those sums from Jonno?
A 3kw system will average at 18 kw per day allowing for some factors in Perth.
At worst, if you dont send anything out you will offset power at 21c/kw.
That equals $3.78 per day, or $1380 per year.
So at $5k for the system, pay off is less than 4 years.

If you get good quality panels and inverter, look at $7k system and 5 year pay off.
But the better quality panels are more efficient, so would generate more, so pay themselve off quicker

That doesnt count power you send out to the grid and get paid more for.

Edited by werdna, 05 June 2011 - 08:49 AM.

[Ivan Sng]

Well just found out today through a colleague asking for a price that because of the reduction of solar credits from 5 to 3, the same system I purchased in Dec 2010, 2.28kW panels + 5kW SMA inverter cost almost $3000 more today.

Sure the cost of having a solar system will eventually come down in price, but it would be a rude shock to those who are keen but are holding out a bit longer for price to drop to find out that six months later, the prices actually when up almost by 1/3.

I am glad I actually went in before the mad rush...

Edited by Ivan Sng, 09 June 2011 - 12:28 AM.