20 replies to this topic

[Zabick]

Hi there,

 

I am building a 2.4mx1mx1m aquarium at the moment(see DIY section).. Just had a few questions about doing a sump. I havent done a sump before, i have always just had cannisters.. but due to the size(2300Ltrs) of this tank i want to put a sump in it..

 

So my questions are..

 

I can get my hands on a 5x2x2 (aprox 440Ltrs) tank or a 4x1x1.5 (aprox 212Ltrs), im sure there isnt such a thing as "overfiltering" but my problem is the larger tank will only leave about 200mm between the top of the sump and the bottom of the tank.. as i havent used a sump before is 200mm enough space, as in do you need to play around with the sump much?. But then i have to make sure i have enough room to accomadate the amount of water in case the power goes out... Which is 24Ltrs per/cm of height..

 

Also what height do people usually put there overflows at?

 

The only other way i thought of doing it would be to use 2 tanks and run dual sumps.. but i dont know if that would be more of a pain than its worth ??

 

Any help would be much appreciated..

Edited by Zabick, 31 May 2013 - 12:15 PM.

[fuggers]

how large is the pump you are looking to install in the sump?

it would decide the width of the pipe needed as the water should not rise above the outlet to the sump. if there is a blackout only the amount that the water that is above the outlet would drain. i may be worth having a bit of a look at other builds to decide on the pump size as it depends on how often you want to tank water to cycle per hour

[Buccal]

Why don't you use a 1000 L ibc.
You can cut the top down to suit height.
They are about 1100 x 1000mm, fill it with K1 media and have a mechanical screen or collection Tray that water falls into.
Example for a mechanical collection tray is a washing basket with black filter sponge sheets lining bottom and sides.
Place the basket top rim two inches about water line in ibc sump.
When water stops passing through the sponge and travels over or around,,, just use a high pressure cleaner to blast it spotless.
K1 is supreme filtration,,, and never EVER BLOCKS UP.,,, all you'll ever have to do is blast the sponge.

[Zabick]

looking around the 12-16000 Lt a hr mark so try to cycle the tank 6-8 times a hr....

 

the ibc is a good idea ... tho it wont fit i only have 900mm back to front for a sump to fit in

[Buccal]

Ok I thought it was 2.4 x 1 x 1.
But if it's 900, is it not a option to bring the tank and stand of the wall 120mm,,, it's not much.

Another option is woodvale fish n lily farm.
They have a Miriad of black poly square ponds.
6ft x 600mm wide x 400mm high
I think they also come in 900mm wide.
Get 50 x 50 jarrah from bunnings and make a mitred ring beam.
Then slide up from the bottom of tub to top till it hits the under side of pond cleats.
Then simply screw through plastic cleats into timber.
This will make it a free standing unit, instead of below ground.

Edited by Buccal, 31 May 2013 - 07:29 PM.

[Zabick]

it is 2.4 x 1 x 1 but once you take out the width of the legs you only have 900 remaining between .. and because of the weight the legs are close together so there isnt a 1m span between them to stick it out the back..

 

I'll have a look at the Pond idea though, might be the best way to go!

 

Just a question would a 4x1x1.5 be to small as a sump, and can you flow too much water through a sump ( as in 8000lph through said 4x1x1.5)??

[Buccal]

Wether it's to small or not depends on the way it's set up and your desired bioload.
K1 media is very efficient and this small size sump should be fine,,, but the common conventional way of setting up sumps would maybe to small.
Liters per hour shouldn't matter,, because only as much will enter as it is leaving the sump.
But teeing it of to three outlets going into sump will take the carnage out.
But I would suggest go biggest sump size possible,,, a tank that big will house a lot of inhabitance, so excessive waiste will be produced.
So you don't want things fouling up prematurely all the time resulting in constant cleaning.
You can also build a plywood box as a sump to the exact size you need.
This box can be painted with exterior paint and simply lined with pond liner,,, very cost effective and tailored perfectly.

[slink]

You can also build a plywood box as a sump to the exact size you need.
This box can be painted with exterior paint and simply lined with pond liner,,, very cost effective and tailored perfectly.

Great idea buccal I might have to do this on my system.

[Zabick]

i was thinking of doin a plywood box for the sump... just looking at options since you can pick up sump tanks for the cost of the plywood alone, but still another one to think about

 

FYI for the partitions silicone doesnt stick to pond liner very well

Edited by Zabick, 31 May 2013 - 10:06 PM.

[azza74]

Hi there Zabick,

I have a sump for sale if your interested. 900mm long x 500mm wide x 460mm high.

If your interested in seeing pics call me on 0427034072

cheers

Aaron

[Zabick]

cheers azza might take you up on that see how i go, i already have a 4ft tank lined up but you never know

[werdna]

My best sump I have used was a 4ft with just one baffle to stop media hitting the pump.

I filled it with hydroton, from memory it needed 1.5 bags.

Then had a layer of filter wool over the top of it to stop the media moving around and for mechanical filtration.

Cost less than $100 to fill it with media.

 

The filter wool got cleaned once every 6 months, the hydroton never got touched.

That filter was in use for 5 years, never had an issue.

I used a 5kl water pump and modified s bend overflow.

 

IMO sumps have such a large surface area for filtration that you don't need expensive filtration.

The limiting factor isn't surface area.

[Buccal]

Yes I think this to,,, sumps have a lot of area for to house media,, so trying to get wiz bang media for a decent size sump is fruitless.
Only look at highly functioning media when filter space is minimized,,,, like canisters and very small sumps.
I find,, especially over east,,, people go so, so, so, overboard with technical filtration.
The k1 or k medias are the bomb,,, as they are most efficient, never block and stay 100% evenly operable.
And almost zero maintenance.
So all the good points of bio filtration is rolled into one,,,, but there's no mechanical collection,, but this can be obtained with a simple collection basket.
K1 takes a little longer to establish and colonize with the superior beneficial bacteria,m,, the reason I say superior is that the turbulent juggling of the media makes it initially a little harder for the beneficial bacteria to colonize.
This gives a much more robust, oxygen loving beneficial bacteria.
The kitchen section at bunnings where the plastic containers are, all kinds of trays with holes in that's just superb for debri collection trays.
The liner in ply box,, doesn't need partitions if k1 is used obviously.
But if partitioning is needed in this set up then....
Then the smallest size retic PVC fittings and PVC can be used,,, the 3way elbow used to form a cube to fit inside sump.
Off cut acrylic can be screwed to one face to create the partition.
Remember this all reasonably cheap if the right places are gone to.
Also good in relation to custom sizes.

[Buccal]

Another way to partition a lined ply box.
Line the inside first with 10mm polystyrene,,,, but where you want dividers leave a 10mm channel down both sides and along bottom.
Then put liner over top of that.
For the partition use like a bread board or plastic like that found as scrap at plastics mobs.
Be sure edges are nicely rounded with no sharp edges or corners.
Once filled with water the channels will show as contours,,, make sure in that area to leave a bit of slack in the liner to take up inside the trench.

[Zabick]

thanks for all the replies.. it has given me some more info and more ideas. still not decided on what to do, but im not in a rush..

[werdna]

Just use the 4ft. Keep it simple.
Even if you don't fill it with superior bacteria...

[sandgroper]

If you can get hold of a 5x2x2, then that would be my choice.

[Valkeris]

Hey,

 

Because I am designing a similar size tank I gave filtration a lot of thought. Given your lack of space in the stand this might work for you too.

I am going to use 100mm PVC pipes arranged in sequence with the media in the pipes. Cap each end with 50mm outlets and course sponge pads to keep the media in the tube.

 

Three banks of pipes. 

1. Mechanical filter using sponge

2. Bioballs or K3 media in suspension

3. (Optional) Nitrate reactor

 

Put a tank or ibc or pond on the beginning to hold water reservoir and  pumps/heaters etc. and you have a very flexible filter.

[Bowdy]

I don't see why you would need a water reservoir. Just use a pump that can be used externally and run and inline heater. If your design needs a reservoir tank then you might as well just run a conventional sump IMO.

[Valkeris]

The reservoir is to increase the total water volume and create a place to hold extra water to ensure the tank is always full. The issue with designing a sump that can take 15000L per hour is allowing enough contact time with the media, using the pvc tube allows you to extend this contact time.