135 replies to this topic

[werdna]

Cmon Den, you knew you would be stirring the PCS opinion pot when you started this topic.
I do love the way you bring out these emotions in people!!!

If the shark attacks are that big a fear then why not get some 300mm stainless mesh put aroud the bay entrances, should stop the big sharks people hate, but not the big fish people love!
I personally believe it is due to our over fishing that the sharks are here in the first place.

I also believe we are in their territory.

I dont believe that just because humans are the top of the food chain we can play god.
Why are we so much more important than everything else?

We wreck the atmosphere. Over fish and pollute waters, over hunt animals to extinction over do EVERYTHING.

African Lions are the top of the food chain, but does that mean that if an antelope kills one, all the lions should get together to take vengeance on the animal that didnt realise it is supposed to lie down and let the lion eat it.

IMO if someone dies while swimming, it happens, get over it.
We have over populated this planet, maybe mother nature is just trying to cull a few of us off to even things up a bit.

Now I am going to climb back up my big tree and get in to my tent and go back to living as an earth loving hippy, translation, turn the a/c up full in my big 4bdrm house that only houses 2 people, cooling 200sqms while only using 50, drawing mass amount of electricity filling the air up with more coal fumes, and when it get to cold, I'll put a jumper on.


Andrew

PS. Happy new year everyone!

[golden_dase]

turn the a/c up full in my big 4bdrm house that only houses 2 people, cooling 200sqms while only using 50, drawing mass amount of electricity filling the air up with more coal fumes, and when it get to cold, I'll put a jumper on.

Andrew

LOL Andrew!

You forgot about all the fish tanks that people have and the amount of power the equipments use....

Happy New Year to you too!

[sleepycod]

hello guys n gals thought id throw my 2 cents worth in to the fire....having grown up in the kimberley and pilbra with crocs n sharks and othernasty bitey things..... point 1: we are in there territory....2:the noise we make wen we swim is similar to a wounded fish ...3: wetsuits make us look like seals and boards like a turtle ...i can see both sides to the argument and both sides make valid and unvalid points....but u have to ask with all the sitings lately are they all the same sharks....penguin and seal islands are close to wear attack took place...did the3 actual shark that took the gent hang around or move on and the other sharks come in to investigate the action...was a gw that took the gent or was it a school of bull sharks and the gw just happend to showup.....i have seen a tiger shark rip a tuna to bits and seconds later bronzes were there to help with the carnage....ppl blamed the bronzies......just a few thoughts i have while reading this topic.... cheers and happy new year to all

[Tucunare]

Killing it would be stupid
I surfed for 12 years, and in that 12 years i would have paddled out 6 days of the week, ive seen 16 all up while surfing and have been circled by 4x 2m bronzes, ive seen GW's upto 5m, tigers at 3m, hammerheads and various others. each time i entered the water i did so under there rules and i knew the risk. i always said if i got done not to kill it, purely for that reason - ITS THERE HOUSE.
Electronic tracking is abit of a joke - unless youve got someone dedicated to indervidual sharks 100% of the time - my point how long do you think it would take a great white to swim from 1km off rotto to the beach to kill someone??? 20mins??? not even enough time to launch a boat to warn people and beside what are the chances of the killer being the 1% that might be tracked -the money wouldbe better spent on shark risk signs.
i think alot of people havea point with that if it was to be killed then why stop there - Crocs, snakes, rays, stonefish, box jellies, irracangies, bees wasps, spiders etc lets kill everything that poses a risk in and out of the metro area just incase it may sting or bite someone - give me a break.
i think the bottem line is if you enter there territory you play by there rules. we are the top of the food chain yet we still continue to act nieve and adopt the therory it will never happen to me.
den if your snorkling storys are true i think youve just pooped in your own nest, if there are that many man eating sharks around you would be dead 100 time over - speared fish, murky water, 100's of metres off shore, wetsuit, surface swimmer, inhanced fish activity (stingrays). Why werent you eaten - because the risk of attack isnt that high and even if you were to have a close encounter the chances of you being killed are even slimmer
my two cents

[Den]

Cmon Den, you knew you would be stirring the PCS opinion pot when you started this topic.
I do love the way you bring out these emotions in people!!!

Hope no one takes offense when I give strong rebuttle, attack me on any of my points, I wont take offense, unless you go off topic and below the belt like Kevin does.

Den, you are not wrong, and neither is anyone else, we do what we have to do with the knowledge and attitudes we have been armed with.

Donna thats my point, this is the problem, people are armed with mis-information from "shark experts".

End of the day, no one is right or left...i mean wrong..

I completely disagree, the people who want to let this attack happen and do nothing about it are wrong, bigtime.

den if your snorkling storys are true

Why werent you eaten - because the risk of attack isnt that high and even if you were to have a close encounter the chances of you being killed are even slimmer

Hi Steve, now its my turn

Off course its true, but as I've stated I reduced then stopped my water activities once it became apparent to me the massive increase in the GW population. My first 19 of 26 years in Rockingham I never heard of a GW sited in Warnbro sound, last seven years sightings here have been increasing. Their appearance at our metro shores have really grown over past several years, no-one seems to know?, guessing possibly attributed to long term protection and them being top of food chain, anyway I made that statement about lots more GW sharks coming and increased attacks at the beginning of this thread and since then there has been a spate of sightings all over metro area, much of the poorly informed general public is only just starting to realise as new sightings only become a media subject once there's a fatality, the poor public just gets he same old BS from shark experts "you have more chance of gettting hit by a car" look at the amount of sightings just in past few days, I will explain some logic to the BS below. Shark researchers do not give a crap about your life, sharks are more important to them, they are fanatics.

Electronic tracking is abit of a joke

Steve I'll explain why its important, if we tag a bunch of GW sharks that come to shore and watch their movements we can get an idea of when and where they are likely to be in their seasonal feeding pattern, we know some of their migratory behaviour "i.e. following the whale migration" but we dont know enough, we can reduce risk of attacks by knowing where great whites are most likely to be feeding during any given season.

i think alot of people havea point with that if it was to be killed then why stop there - Crocs, snakes, rays, stonefish, box jellies, irracangies, bees wasps, spiders etc lets kill everything that poses a risk in and out of the metro area just incase it may sting or bite someone - give me a break.

I dont know where to go here Steve I can really pull your whole arguement apart in a million peices, here for example we have developed antivenom for snake and most poisionous bites in order to save lives, unfortunately we cant do the same for a great white shark bite, a different tactic is required. Cros are not in metro areas and there is already a dangerous croc program in place in populated places up north. We have nothing in place for dealing with increasing great white attacks, other than to let them go free after an attack in populous metro waterways.


Lets explore:

"You have more chance of getting hit by a car than getting attacked by a shark"

I'll explain why this is a complete BS cliche that people who are expert at being idiots like to propel to the general public. This statement applys to you if you are a water hating quadraplegic who lives in Lesmurdie, however if you are one of the 0.0001% of the people who regularly swim in the open ocean your risks of getting attacked by a shark are 1000 times more than getting hit by a car.

99.999% of the public do not use the beach regularly so its the same as saying "women over the age of 60 who have osteoporosis have more chance of getting hit by a car than suffering a broken bone while playing rugby." Just because more elderly ladies walk near roads than play rugby, does this mean its safe for your 75 year old grand mother with degenerative bone disease to play rugby? I know diving enthusiasts who live near the beach with their own gear and boats and even these guys struggle to fit over a dozen 1 hour dives in a year!! If you use the water regularly you will eventually be attacked or eaten, last several W.A. fatalities were people who use the water regularly, this will grow unless public understanding and attitude changes, it would be nice if we could be pre-emtive about it, prevent attacks, but unfortunately people will need to die horrible deaths before we take action. Just remember, there is a large brown shark turd at the dark bottom of Warbro sound that has a wedding ring in it.

Anyone else wanna be friends with me

Cheers
Den

[CCA001]

Hey Den sorry but just to stir the pot a little more why cant you just build a bridge and get over it i mean how hard is it to just sit back and think, Hell maybe i am taking this all abit to seriously, all in all i think and tend to agree with a couple of others you just get a great kick out of stirring the pot and seeing what happens.

Waits for a GREAT reply to this one

[Shane_H]

The man that got taken in Port Kennedy was a MASSIVE fisherman. Heavily involved in the Western Angler online forums, so well known to the online fihsing community.

I didn't know they bloke at all, but speaking purely from a fishermans point of view, I think it's almost ironic. You spend your entire life hunting, releasing and often eating fish...the whole time thinking you're at the top of the food chain. I'd like to think an almost calming thought would have been the last thing going through Mr Guest's mind, knowing that after all these years, he's still just another link in the chain.

When it all boils down, thats all we are in this world. Top level predators as well as pieces of meat. Like his son said, he and his family would not want the Shark destroyed.

[Hydonia]

All life is precious and we should not destroy anything because we fear it. It's that simple.

[Den]

CCA001 Sorry but Im Capricorn, being serious is in my blood, anyhow I thought this was a serious subject.

Shane I agree the irony is astonishing, what would be more ironic would be if people started getting eaten alive by killer pigs, sheep, cows and huge mutant vegtables.

I fear new news headlines coming from Warnbro sound this weekend.

Cheers
Den

[Donna]

Den,

I'm Capricorn too....just wondering though, where did the clairvoyancy come from?



Regards,

Donna

[CCA001]

This is a serious subject NOT only to you but alot of others but you and sorry you only are taking this a little bit over the top by making the same remarks over and over again just to keep ppl biting which is NOT being serious is just being an antagonist.

Why cant you just LEAVE it be you have had your say and so have others. lets see what happens in the future.

Hmmmmmmmmm on another point YES plenty of other sightings close to the beach but NO attacks WHY NOT .

Thats it for me getting sick and tired of the same old (chooses word carefully) STUFF being repeated over and over but maybe in a little bit of different concept.

As i said before build a bridge and get over it.

If you want something to complain about maybe write to the government and ask why they want to kill 1 shark because it ate someone but they can leave all the criminals in jail to live of our TAX money that have killed ANOTHER HUMAN BEING now how is that justice and they have been proven guilty, what happened if YOU MURDERED the WRONG shark that hadnt killed anybody should we send them to JAIL aswell for killing an INNOCENT animal.

As i said OVER AND OUT for me on this as it seems NO one else is correct on this matter but you.

[Den]

Hi CCAA001.

sorry you only are taking this a little bit over the top by making the same remarks over and over again just to keep ppl biting which is NOT being serious is just being an antagonist.

Not intending to be antagonistic at all, I'm put in the position to repeat myself because some people (like you for example) are directing their statements and/or questions at me so I feel compelled to answer as a matter of courtesy and in some cases self defense, such as this new post, if reading the same thing twice bothers you, shouldnt you blame the question asker, not the person who courteously answers?

You've asked more questions which seem directed at me?, "i.e. NO attacks WHY NOT", if you want opinions & answers please read the whole thread, as some members are complaining about me repeating myself .

NO one else is correct on this matter but you.

I agree with you on this point only, the rest I disagree with. but really thats for each individual to judge, I am fighting against what I believe is a "current hypocritical trend of saving man eaters, while killing millions of harmless sharks for fish and chips" and my aim is to expose it and explain my logic and reasoning.

I'm Capricorn too....just wondering though, where did the clairvoyancy come from?

Donna Im not trying to be clairvoyant, Im just playing the numbers/odds, hot weekend coming up with good sea breezes, I expect alot of people "food" in our warnbro sound, a partially enclosed bay that has at least one man eating shark on the loose, like putting a cat in a dove cage, oh the humanity people.

Cheers
Den

[FishGal]

As this attack has pointed out....we are NOT top of the food chain....

[Tucunare]

so Den what your saying then is if a bite can be fixed by antivenom then its far less serious than a bite that cant???, yes anti venom is available, however we still have deaths from spiders and snakes every year, im sure hundreds of people are bitten by sharks every year, Wobbys, gummys, catsharks, none of which are fatal just require the same medical attention as the spider bites but in a different form.
spiders/ snakes can and do kill every year.
sharks can and do kill every year.
its the same argument.
crocs maybe non metro but there certainly around major towns and cities up north, which yeah they may have actions in place at popular places but hey so do alot of beaches with shark nets.
again your arguing about the same thing.
and my last point is the facts are the facts, whichever way you want to twist it, more people get hit by cars than shark bites every year. experts are labelled as such because they base there comments and statements on more than personal opinions and google searches

[ZOLTAN]

Ahahaha steve green, mate you haven't changed abit! but switch the 2 packets of chips and go for 4 packets of road kills ringburner beef jerky.

[daci]

ok!

anyone on this thread going to the BBQ?

i still got several of these you can borrorw if all things fail hahaha

[Den]

If anyone else calls me an antagoniser watch out! Im the one being taunted and antagonised on this thread! but I'm not complaining, I love it!

so Den what your saying then is if a bite can be fixed by antivenom then its far less serious than a bite that cant???,

Absoloutely not, I will repeat myself as you seem to have not understood my intitial response or my many other repeated posts?, my point here is that we have systems in place to deal with the prevention and effects of venomous animals and crocs. i.e. we make efforts to reduce attacks and develop anitvenom/treatments for victims, with man eating sharks in metro waters there is no effort to reduce the potential for attacks from what is becoming an increasingly common menace. What do shark experts give us? nice photos thats all, all they seem to do is take photos and tell us "the car accident cliche".

My second point Great Whites have been under long term protection, with the number of attacks and encounters in WA growing every year they are obviously increasing in population, what I'm saying is should we do somthing now to prevent further attacks and the number of attacks from increasing?, or do we wait until there are dozens of attacks a year in Perth before we say "maybe we should do something about it?" Steve looking at your whole arguement, you want to wait like others for more people to die first, do you people also leave doing water changes until your fish get sick? probably.

i.e. since this last attack we had the opportunity to kill that shark and reduce the risk of another attack in our Bay, but very silly people chose to do nothing!, only to allow another attack of a boat to follow a few days later, sheer luck in the fact no one was in the water near the boat avoided another death. Some may argue it may have been two different sharks, but where would be your logic trying to argue that point?, I would argue back that if there were 2 sharks it just shows even more the urgency of why we need to do something!,( i.e. it means then there should be 2 culled sharks!) though I would say it was likely the same shark.

I bet not a single person here who is against me are regular users of Warnbro sound, most of you have probably never even seen our bay let alone swam, fished, windsurfed or snorkelled in it, so I can understand why you dont care about taking any action, it simply just doesnt effect you like it effects me & other people. My friend and her 3 children arrived at the attack scene just after it happened, had the attack not happened in such timing, she and her kids were planning to swim on that same beach!

experts are labelled as such because they base there comments and statements on more than personal opinions and google searches

Our family have lived in Safety Bay since at least early 60's maybe even earlier, I am third generation living here, many of us are keen fisherman and we have lots of contact on whats going on in our waters. My cousins were shark fisherman here in the 60s and 70s, and I can tell you whites are getting increasingly common in our waters, luckily most stay outside the bay.

PS Daci, you should take those swords down to safety bay and sell them to swimmers at warnbro and waikiki beach, they now need the protection! I also want to buy two of those swords for when I go snorkelling!

Cheers
Den

[dazzabozza]

with man eating sharks in metro waters there is no effort to reduce the potential for attacks from what is becoming increasingly common menace.

If we didn't over-fish there's prob less likelyhood of them coming in so close in search for food. That'll be a good place to start in regards to prevention.

[Tucunare]

seen as im not doing water changes and waiting for people to die, i have plenty of time on my hands to reply.
ive pobably used the bay area more than you den, with trips daily to the islands to surf for about 8 years, long point fishing, secret harbour surfing, crabbing at safety bay etc etc etc and im against your comments.
now you say nothing has or is being done, though we have chopper and plane patrols, beach patrols, life guard whatch towers, shark sirens, shark net and electronic shark repelent devises. sure not at warnbro but at many other beaches and the choices are there to use those beaches or to buy the electonic devices.
you say that shark numbers are on the rise. do you have proof, or is that just a statement because of the extra attention that the issues been atracting??? my guess is 99% of shark sighting would go undocumented, for example all the ones ive seen have never been reported even the 4 that circled me. nearly all my mates that surf, dive and whatever dont report there shark encounters either. two years ago my mate was pinned to a rockwall at seal island by a 2m GW, he escaped by jamming his cray bag in its mouth - not reported, and a few years before that another mate of mine was grabbed on his shorts when surfing the cove at hillaries again not reported. im just wondering if its not the hype thats blown it all out of controll making people think that theres more man eaters around?????.
again i can name about 10 shark storys out of warnbro sound in the last two years just from people i know. facts are there everywhere, they always have been, id be very suprised if the numbers have increase - not the reported sighting numbers but the actual numbers which only mother nature knows.
at the end of the day we still choose to venture into there world so we should accept the terms they play on.
a serious question. do you think killing the possible 2 sharks will have any effect on humun life from here on out??? or an even better question would a cull of say 100 gw in wa waters each year make the beaches safer??? - the saying wrong place at the wrong time comes to mind. so where in your opinion would the killing stop???

[Den]

Steve most of your points are either incorrect, out of context and some only futher validate my arguement.

ive pobably used the bay area more than you den, with trips daily to the islands to surf for about 8 years, long point fishing, secret harbour surfing, crabbing at safety bay etc etc etc

Dont know what this has to do with the subject, who uses/used the water more is irrellevant, what is relevant is how many people are using the water where this man eating shark has been left to roam, but if you want to make it a point I can tell you I was surfing in secret harbour(we called it Annesty, no roads, use to be nothing but a sand tracks out there back then!), swimming, snokelling all over warnbro ,Waikiki , shoalwater, and Safety Bay while you still had nappies on mate, and thats a fact!

now you say nothing has or is being done, though we have chopper and plane patrols, beach patrols, life guard whatch towers, shark sirens, shark net and electronic shark repelent devises. sure not at warnbro

Air patrols are only active for short times after an attack, which is my point the little we do happens when its too late, someone has to die! previous partols were cancelled to my knowledge, but even full time patrols are only a small part of the prevention solution, culling option in some cases needs to be added to the list such as this recent instance.

"not sure at warnbro"

are these the words of a person whom we should trust an opinion and believe is a regular Warnbro sound/beach user?

The rest of your arguement you spend just contradicting yourself,

i.e.

you say that shark numbers are on the rise. do you have proof, or is that just a statement because of the extra attention that the issues been atracting???

contradicted by:

again i can name about 10 shark storys out of warnbro sound in the last two years just from people i know.

Just my point, shark numbers are increaasingly being spotted near our populated beachs. How about you give us a Warnbro Sound shark story that is from between 7 and 30 years ago? You cant, why not? because there arent any, surely I dont need to explain this? work it out mate.

You share with us a number of shark encounters, some of which if reported to a shark hotline could increase awarness and help prevent further attacks. A GW shark hotline is another idea that might save lives, but many people are happy for nothing to be done because they are either unaware or unaffected, at least for now.

I can go on, but Im sure most people can work out for themselves that basically your whole arguement is a contradiction, and only further supports what I am saying.

Cheers
Den