16 replies to this topic

[The Simple Guy]

Just came home from a usual 24 hr shift at work to discover an ich outbreak and loss of 3 fish with another handful showing the pinhead sized white spots covering their body.

Im aware that ich is a common parasite so im posting this up to keep track and get any advice from u guys if im doing something wrong.

Water parameters are

Ammonia: 0.25
Nitrite: 0
Nirtate: 20
Temp: 27

So far for treatment ive given a dose of white spot remedy which ill need to repeat in 3 days time. Tomorrow ill be heading down to a lfs to get some NLS with the added garlic.
I was going to raise the temp but doing abit of reading advised not to because that will null the medications effects.
I was abit unsure if adding aquarium salt would be benificial or not

The only things ive done to the tank within the last week is add a sump and used my canisters bio media to fill it until the moving bed gets established. Canisters are still running with the filter pads, outlet turned down and is plumbed into a uv sterilizer to give the water column a longer period under the light.

Fish are fed either once daily or 2 small feeds with an off day during the week

Is there something im missing or could be doing differently to aid in the fish recovery?

Thanks guys

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[malawiman85]

What are the fish?
Standard treatment should be temp to 31 and some pool salt from Bunnings at about 6ppt unless you have loaches, catties or other salt sensitive fish.
Increase oxygen as you increase temp or add meds.

[In between tanks]

Turned up temp to 30'c, and left it for 12 days.
Then 28'c for 7 days
Then back to 26'c where it stays at.

Total cure, not one died out of 40-50 fish.

[The Simple Guy]

The tank is a wide mix of Malawis with a few tangs and loaches. Its seems like all the deaths at the moment are from the Tropheus sp. Moliro's (Lost 4 already out of my 5)

Ive already got the airpump on full ball and both powerheads facing the water surface.

Tomorrow ill start the temp rises so i can watch for stress and start adding the salt.

Thanks for the help so far, it does feel abit more reassuring you guys are inline with what im reading.

Since i do have 3 loaches would it be advisable to add the salt at a dose of 3-4 ppt or go even lower?

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[deliriouz]

Protozin for three days. Worked everytime and nothing died.Heat and salt wiped out all my plants and ĺ numbers.

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[malawiman85]

Honestly, I wouldnt bother with salt as you are cranking the heat and using commercial ich medication. I would only use salt with species that couldnt handle the temp being raised to 31.

[Morley Aquariums]

Turn off the uv while medicating, most meds are light sensitive. Also ensure no chemical media such as carbon, zeolites or purigen are in use

[Buccal]

My little cube display a while back, when I loaded it up with tetras, loaches and Cory's from 4 different shops in the same day, I know I was asking for it,,, but it was a very mature system with a monster pond canister filter suited to 15000 liters, and my tank is only 600mm cube lol.
But yep, as 'in between tanks' did,,, I turned up to 31'c for a extended time,,,, and jeez did it work well.

[bigjohnnofish]

and be aware some medications can kill off some/all of your beneficial bacteria so its a good idea to be testing your ammonia levels while treating...

 

beneficial bacteria can build up resistance to some medications over time but dont rely on this - test your water

[BengaBoy]

Turned up temp to 30'c, and left it for 12 days.
Then 28'c for 7 days
Then back to 26'c where it stays at.

 

sounds like a pretty standard summer in Perth?

[mjoconr]

I would not use the salt because of you mixed species. Medication is the go. If the tank habitants can handle the temp take it up as this speeds up the protozoan life cycle. Making the medication more effective.

[malawiman85]

The heat doesnt just speed up the ich cycle, it kills it... dead. Thats why over 30 is important. In almost all instances commercial ich preparations are not required or even desired due to cost and malachite green staining stuff.

[mjoconr]

Heat does speed up the life cycle. Many references to this on the net. http://www.aquahobby...cles/e_ich2.phpbeing just one and the salt is what kills it but with is mixed tank I think the medication is the best option.

Edited by mjoconr, 31 December 2015 - 07:18 AM.

[malawiman85]

Yeah of course it does, never said it doesnt, but speeding it up on its own doesnt help. The point is turning up heat above 30 doesnt simply speed up the cycle, it is a cure.

Edited by malawiman85, 31 December 2015 - 07:40 AM.

[mjoconr]

Re-reading a few of the online article, some mention the heat in its self stops ick. I had not noticed that before. So as long as you fish can take the temperature it could kill off ick with no other action. I think I'll still use salt or medication.

Edited by mjoconr, 31 December 2015 - 08:23 AM.

[Buccal]

Besides cool stream loaches and a lot of cool water rainbow species, most fish can handle a 30 temp, and as MM already mentioned earlier, heavy surface aggetation.
Some fish keepers that I've come across in the past have thought their fish died in the summer because the water was to hot for them.
It's a entire contribution to a cause, but it's not the heat itself that effects the fish.
It's the heat (30'c and upwards), that drastically reduces waters capability of being saturated or holding oxygen.
The stiff surface turn over will force oxygen into the water with low levels of heat in the red zone being 29'c - 34'c,,,, but getting up and over 35'c it starts to make putting oxygen into water very very hard.
That's if your beneficial bacteria hasn't been drastically degraded first.

I've tried full strength koi meds, and many other meds, salts,,,, mainly when I was very young a very long time ago when ich was more prevelent for me.
Back then my rather sloppy maintenance saw neutral ph wanting to steer acid all the time which wasn't great and a underlining problem which wasn't ideal for the fish,,,,,, so sometimes cranking up temp can have a negative impact without thinking first,, LIKE HEAVY SURFACE AGGETATION.

Rising the temp is a real remedy that works better than any other.
Just go easy raising it, though being summer has a transition effect already.

Remember with these wacky boiling then cool days into nights,,,, the temp with heaters turned off can go up to 30'c then down to 25'c fairly fast,,,,,,, this drastic temp drop can cause ich outbreaks, especially iff there's other unrelated minor issues already present adding to weakend immune systems.
If your keeping Malawi and tangs or other hard water loving fish,, then keeping your KH level high to where it needs to be will keep the fish just that little bit healthier.

[Buccal]

Re-reading a few of the online article, some mention the heat in its self stops ick. I had not noticed that before. So as long as you fish can take the temperature it could kill off ick with no other action. I think I'll still use salt or medication.

I was already writing my last post while you submitted this,,,, but turning up heat to say 28 or 29 will actually speed up the cycle so fast that the organism matures and becomes spent before it can attach itself to the fish and prepare for its cycle in life to multiply and spread.
So the parasite just ages 3 x faster and loses its needed continual cycle to replicate and spread.
So it dies out once it's detached from the fish, as does with medication.
29'c works to,,,, just do it, you'll be surprised,,, and so so so much easier.