61 replies to this topic

[malawiman85]

never seen so many people group together and be wrong,,,, except for election time in 2007 Kevin 07. Lol.

HAHAHAHAHA funny.
See how we go today...

[sandgroper]

Protomelas mbenji thick lips.

 

 

Buccal you must be a slow learner, i gave up helping the builders 10 years ago. There all idiots, always doing things ass about face. There only interested in larger profit, therefore they pay peanuts and get monkeys and end up doing everything twice.

Edited by dicky7, 02 July 2016 - 04:19 PM.

[Buccal]

Close,,,, these to have been then through our shops,,, Eclectochromis ornatus msenje,,, I've had people say there's no msenje,, but was plain as day where I got it from with a list.
But, I also have Protomelus mbenji thick lips, these fish are way smaller,,, the ornatus gets very big,,, the pic above, they are fair bit bigger than my open hand.

Eclectochromis is the same meaning as Protomelus and Eclectochromis has been changed to Protomelus also.
If anyone looks at German lists of cichlidstadel they still use the term Eclectochromis,,, and I to prefer it, as all Eclectochromis are a much bigger specie and most seem to have more protruded nose compared to Protomelus.
Big tall craters and mad shaking and dancing,,, really massive eggs,,, one female punches out up to 60 fry,, another peaceful fish that both sexes are respectful of each other.

[Buccal]

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[Chopstick_mike]

I'm just stoked you have figured out ho to post pics now we can all see your awesome collection

[Buccal]

Lol, yes, but the flood of emails people wanting,,, if there was 35 hours in a day, I'd be good for time, but loyalty to shops as in all bussines activity of mine has always proven good outcomes.
Plus for some reason some people get annoyed like I'm showing off somehow,, I see it like trying to stoke a fire to make it bigger and stronger/better.

[Spiesie]

Finally one I am certain of

Otopharynx auromarginatus margaretae

[Chopstick_mike]

Lol, yes, but the flood of emails people wanting,,, if there was 35 hours in a day, I'd be good for time, but loyalty to shops as in all bussines activity of mine has always proven good outcomes.
Plus for some reason some people get annoyed like I'm showing off somehow,, I see it like trying to stoke a fire to make it bigger and stronger/better.

pfft , I like seeing people's collections and knowing what they breed

[Jman#1]

Jman#1 - I think the idea was to guess first what specie Buccal has I think yours is Labidochromis Chisumulae or Nkali

Buccal - what a stunner. I'll start by guessing it's Copadichromis of some sort?

righto got it! He is a stunner and yes. Male nkali


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[Buccal]

pfft , I like seeing people's collections and knowing what they breed

hah,,, hah,,, I know didn't mean that way,, I'll give a never ending stream of info to anybody, when I get the time at night.
It's the sea of people purely just chasing fish gets to much, profit from these is so low,, by the time you frig around having people come over at certain times then striking conversation (trust me at my house and me, there's like two years worth of conversation lol),,, my life is completely gone,, then there were deliveries to both shops and airport on the weekend,,, not a very well balanced life to have.

[Buccal]

Finally one I am certain of
Otopharynx auromarginatus margaretae

bingo yes,,, just a shame some of these such beautiful fish take so long to color up,, as it would help to have novices enforce their popularity also, novices just go for instant color and known colorful fish.
These Otopharynx like a few other oto types, do a excellent job at keeping the substrate super duper clean and turned over.
These would have to be one of the most peaceful fish I've come across.
A excellent display would see about 8 males and two females to keep the males sparked up with color.

[Terry]

.
I havnt met any one else in Perth that could safely say they made profit from breeding fish after all expenses,
 

 

Have we ever met Buccal ? My fish room runs at a profit and has done for the last 12 years.

[Poncho]

Lol.. I was waiting for either you or big johnno to bite at that one Terry

[Buccal]

I know I didn't really mention it properly,, specializing in Malawi or tangs,, my posts here only about these and maybe the last time anyone sees some of these species ever again in real life.
Havnt seen many continually going selling solely cichlids,,, I know there was Pierre.

The catfish and angel fish with all the 50c fish are not in danger of being lost.
But even if there is one or two other breeders,, it's still showing hardly anyone making a profit from breeding and supporting my point still.

[Poncho]

I didn't comment earlier as I didn't want to hijack the thread. I'd agree it's currently impossible to have an exclusively African cichlid fish room and turn a profit at the moment. 7-10 years ago it was a whole different story and there were quite a few of us with small to moderate sized rooms and in the black.

I'd suggest that your economic strategy is flawed and more than likely a contributing factor to this. It sounds good in theory but in practice has clearly not worked otherwise you'd still be breeding fish like Terry and big johnno. The main problem as I see it is you are in Perth. There's a limited market and the hobby is predominately isolated (small % will trade interstate) and small in terms of numbers in comparison to the eastern states. You have a high turnover in terms of people who come into the hobby and leave the hobby which is IMO the biggest influencing factor on your market.

Your model as I understand through your previous posts is to breed high volumes of fish with a moderate amount of species diversity. Then sell small juveniles to lower overheads created by raising fry too long. The release of each species is carefully monitored so as not to flood markets and maintain a high price point.

However, given that the Perth hobby is small, not exclusively interested in Africans and predominately uninformed about African species due to being new to the hobby, what they actually see is a shop full of little silver fish for $30-$100 each. It's unattractive to a new hobbyist. The more learned hobbyist knows the fish, but chances are they also know how to source them cheaper or understand there's no point in breeding that species because you've already got that market covered and so they look for something different.

The end result is a heap of rarish fish sitting in lfs tanks for months on end and boring the shit out of customers who want to see something different each time they visit the store. For all the crap that is flung at Robs Aquariums, for mine I think they've got it sussed and have been able to persist in this economic climate for the hobby selling predominately African cichlids. Their economic strategy is almost the complete opposite to yours and I think they deserve a lot of credit that they're not currently getting from hobbyists.

It's a real shame that Perth can't support a breeder of the scale you want to operate at. It's a credit that despite the lack of sales you're committed to preserving the species you've collected. I'm upset to hear word of you considering selling the breeding stock as if you do, they will most likely be lost. I had to sell my collection for personal reasons about 6-7 years ago and had species that you will struggle to source now. I regret it but at the time had no choice.

I think the solution to this economic limitation with the hobby is to lower price a bit to make the entry point for new people more attractive given you need to buy more than one fish, lower total volume to match current demand but build on volume/not price once that is re-established and focus on building hobbyist knowledge base and getting them to better appreciate what the little silver fish in the shops will turn into - that's a major role for the PCS and we rely on our active membership to do this too as its a huge task.

Threads like this and photos and discussions on the forum are gold so I'll shut up now and hope to see some more stunning fish to be identified

[Buccal]

I'd have to say I'd disagree with roughly 60% of that, very strongly,,, if it's true what you say, then Perth will have no problem with sustaining then,,,
Bring price down,, hah, hah, no one was ever cheaper than me, nor as big,,,.
I have no idea what Terry's turnover is, but likely a whole lot less than I'd be happy with, he's retired,,, I'm directly contracting to builders so very busy,,, I weigh up time spent delivering right down to time feeding and fry management and all costs,,, when there was money around and many fisho heads,, the overall demand was there,, and that's what I serviced,, times have changed with bugger all demand and I'm left with a out fit that consumes electricity and much fish food,,, but it really has forced me to find out and work out some amazing things,,, like my whole breed room 33000 liters (leaving the 20000 outdoor heated growout out of it), all those liters,, and I never clean filters except a few little power heads,,, my 4 meter centrifugal sump never has to be cleaned ever.

Can't bring Johnno into it,,, when get a truckload of money for one zebra,,, but I'm flying with my $rays$.
Another type of fish $$$$ that I kill it on I won't mention,,, I'm just thinking, how silly it as to mess around costly expensive fish from Germany or the shops and sell them for a few dollars, sometimes almost costing as it these days,,,,
Anyway,,, not boasting, but I earn 3 incomes in one, and that's just my normal day job, So,, my fish ain't going anywhere,, every single one stays with me,, I'm the mad fish man,, I have to have them, I love them,, when I have time under my belt, I really love slowly going from tank to tank feeding them in full color, and seeing all the moms holding and fry everywhere all through the filters and stuff..
Lol,,, it's extremely like I kill stop breeding and supplying,, but you all know how a little odd or weird I seem at times,,, well this's it now lol ha ha,,, I'm actually doubling the size of my breed room and putting more outdoor runways down,,, but I'm not taking fry or selling.
Only fry is for my self,,,,, I plan to station them here into my my day job retirement.
They'll still be lost because they'll be unobtainable,,,, and the time between now and the extenstion finished is the danger time because some species I'll Lose till change over, and I decide to devote actual breeding labor.

The new shop you saying they got it right,,, hah ha,,, typical,, that is absolute short term bussiness decisions that does not support the future of this,,, good reason why prices of the fish went up wouldn't you think,,, it's the problem with the fish market, not many people are realists,,,, many think they are,,, things that sound right aren't always right,,, look at our politicians.
That's why, in my world I don't guess and make statements, I just know because I'm the pig,,,,, it's only the pig in his own shiz that knows his shiz best,,,,,,,,, look back in the past on Pcs and some things I've said about the future of cichlids,,, it's all unfolded the way I thought,,,,,,,,, if there was going to be any surge or last glimmer hope,, that would have been the turn of the new import laws,,, got a sneeze, but not much more.

If only 2 people out of 10 people wanted a apple,, and the other 8 don't.
What makes you think making those apples cheaper will make the other 8 want them ???
Short term last ditch efforts of a dying bussiness if you ask me.....
Funny thing is,, if one studies bussiness, one gets a perception,, but when that one carries out bussiness for the first time, it's nothing like he thought it was,, even though he lived and breathed it studying,,,,,,
Hmm, is that metaphoric philosophy.

[Westie]

less talking.... more photos! 

[Poncho]

If metaphoric philosophy is the same as absolute crap then yes

[malawiman85]

Hard to get upset about the cichlid hobby falling over when its due to a lack of interest.

Some will say its lack of passion... what evz, there simply isnt interest, hasnt been for ages.

Some will say its because hobbyists are too tight to spend the money... its not, its just there is no interest in the fish offered.

Some say its due to an over zealous regulator... its not. If it were we wouldnt have been losing moderatly easy to breed species over the years

Some say its due to the price of electricity... sure its something to bitch about but I never met anyone who pulled one or two tanks down due to the cost of running them (fish rooms are another story). Africans are a part of the hobby thats gone... kinda like roller blades from skate parks. Fish keeping is still popular but cichlids arent. The best thing a business can do is adapt and cater for the remaining hobbyists that want to buy cichlids and perhaps look at encouraging entry level purchases of quality fish. 

At the end of the day, most people are over paying decent money for little blue fish.

Edited by malawiman85, 05 July 2016 - 10:02 PM.

[Buccal]

If metaphoric philosophy is the same as absolute crap then yes

true, if your trying to say I'm trying to relate the sciences with philosophy,,, but no, I used metaphors to let everyone understand the concepts I'm explaining,, just common things that pan out in similar fashion,,,,, Jeez lots of calling black and white on here still.

Edited by Buccal, 06 July 2016 - 03:25 AM.