61 replies to this topic

[Buccal]

Hard to get upset about the cichlid hobby falling over when its due to a lack of interest.
Some will say its lack of passion... what evz, there simply isnt interest, hasnt been for ages.
Some will say its because hobbyists are too tight to spend the money... its not, its just there is no interest in the fish offered.
Some say its due to an over zealous regulator... its not. If it were we wouldnt have been losing moderatly easy to breed species over the years
Some say its due to the price of electricity... sure its something to bitch about but I never met anyone who pulled one or two tanks down due to the cost of running them (fish rooms are another story). Africans are a part of the hobby thats gone... kinda like roller blades from skate parks. Fish keeping is still popular but cichlids arent. The best thing a business can do is adapt and cater for the remaining hobbyists that want to buy cichlids and perhaps look at encouraging entry level purchases of quality fish. 
At the end of the day, most people are over paying decent money for little blue fish.

im glad someone else can see it clear as I can,, it's not that hard,,,,,, This thread was more of a reminiscent thing of what we had, even though they are pics taken today.

In my new outdoor sections I'm building,, I'm thinking in future, is to breed fish and grow them out and only have about 20 of each specie avaliable, but fully colored and male only, and priced highly, so people can still enjoy these stunning colorful fish as display.....

With fish and rays and others,,, I'm a master adaptor when it comes to bussiness, and I'll take a whole new approach to it all.
Big, fat and healthy fish glowing with color at decent sizes will get the sure sales.....
Instant display Package deals of all male stunners,,, I think I might be onto something really good here because I'll be the only one that could replicate all the ones that I have that others don't, which in time will almost be all of my cichlids. Something like $300 for six big colorful display males,, but by then the market will be exceptionally small.
Oz economy over the next two years is going to tighten greatly as the building industry regulates to the current climate.

Edited by Buccal, 06 July 2016 - 03:32 AM.

[Poncho]

Lol... Really?

MM basically said that cichlids were overpriced. You laugh when I say it but then say he gets it - WTF Buccal?

You also said you were solely talking about African cichlids but then started going on about Ray's and other mystery things one post later.Trying to have a discussion with you is futile because you are so inconsistent. You flip flop like a fish out of water and refuse to see things any other way despite another person showing real life examples. You refute them with nothing more than an opinion and seem hell bent on being right as opposed to accurate or truthful. I expect you'll chuck a sad and turn your posts into full stops again because I'm not playing nice anymore but If anyone can understand buccals response to my post could you please interpret it for me as I seriously have no idea what he means by it.

on second thought, just post some pics again. Can't see any point in discussion with you involved

[Mattia]

Take a pot shot -<br /> <br />This one is super easy, but i want the scientific name - picture taken at Nankhoma Island <br /><br /><br /><br />Don't make me clean up the topic because I could mess up again and delete it

[chocky]

Take a pot shot -

This one is super easy, but i want the scientific name - picture taken at Nankhoma Island



Don't make me clean up the topic because I could mess up again and delete it

hahaha people making you work while you're away!

[Spiesie]

Metriaclima callainos?

 

 

Maylandia flavifemina in background?

Edited by Spiesie, 06 July 2016 - 08:21 AM.

[Chopstick_mike]

I agree with spiesie colbalt blue

[Mattia]

Yep, good job Spiesie!<br /><br />The one in the back is not a flavifemina. I should have some better pics of it, I'll try to upload it later tonight

[Buccal]

Lol... Really?
MM basically said that cichlids were overpriced. You laugh when I say it but then say he gets it - WTF Buccal?
You also said you were solely talking about African cichlids but then started going on about Ray's and other mystery things one post later.Trying to have a discussion with you is futile because you are so inconsistent. You flip flop like a fish out of water and refuse to see things any other way despite another person showing real life examples. You refute them with nothing more than an opinion and seem hell bent on being right as opposed to accurate or truthful. I expect you'll chuck a sad and turn your posts into full stops again because I'm not playing nice anymore but If anyone can understand buccals response to my post could you please interpret it for me as I seriously have no idea what he means by it.
on second thought, just post some pics again. Can't see any point in discussion with you involved

dude it gets like this, because your the only one that kind of takes things and slightly twists them with the ordasity to describe me.
MM described the state of the market and he had it spot on,,, just because he mentioned over priced and I said what ? (Glad that some one sees it as I can). Lol,, give me a break.
What does over priced mean ??? Breeder to shop ?, shop to customers ?, for what average people can afford ?,,,,,, HAH, the actual reality of the fact in its self only in my own self defense, is when mm said over priced, I just saw that as his little personal side view,, and thought nothing more of it.

I merely mentioned rays at the same time noting I was meaning cichlids only, and went on to say, if you say look at Johnno and terry,, I was merely adding my entire operation I was absolutely killing it, but the cichlids are slightly bleeding it,,,, now Poncho I had to say slightly bleeding it, because if I didn't say slightly you may automatically conjure up I'm running at a loss. Lol. Discussion with me is futile and I'm inconsistent,,, I'm only inconsistent when you rephrase them to make me look like that.

NOW YOU GO BACK IN THIS THREAD AND RE READ HOW YOU STARTED OUT AND GOT ME GOING.
THEN CHECK OUT OTHER SIMILAR THREADS.
You step in, explain how I am in your slightly tweaked version of me.

Edited by Buccal, 06 July 2016 - 08:33 PM.

[Mattia]

There we go, this was the fish in the previous photo:<br /><br />Should be easy from this view <br /><br />

[Spiesie]

Can't see so well on my phone. Will look tomorrow on the computer. Is it some sort of Tropheops? Red cheek perhaps?

[mac]

Tropheops Mbenji Blue?

[Poncho]

Yeah whatever Buccal. You'll keep going as long as I do but there's a limit to how much crap I can see posted before I react. Apologies to others that get tired of it but when I receive numerous pm's saying good on you for calling bullshit, I'm encouraged to respond. The alternative is to leave the crap up uncontested and risk people believing it. To those that are over it already, I'm sorry but I will shut up after this one, I promise.

Buccal If you understood markets then you'd understand what your market wants to buy. Economics 101 - Its where you should start if wanting to play in that game and I'm not a stranger to it despite what you imply. I just don't need to promote my experience or knowledge ad nauseum to feel credible. I maintain a good insight on what the market wants because at least once per month I go out and meet people who are the market and speak to them about what they're interested in. It provides a great insight. Ever watch Ramsey kitchen nightmares? He tells restuaranteurs to get out and ask their market what they want. When they do, they start to see how to adapt their business. You stopped trading privately and said something about not having time to chat and trade your fish. Get out and listen to newbies rather than preach to them on a forum if you want to be seen as credible when it comes to knowing the market. I think you are the one being audacious by implying I have little understanding of the matter because I do listen to a number of fellow fish keepers which are the market. Selling fat Malawi males for $300 for 6 - happy to be proved wrong but sounds like a dud to me based on my numerous conversations with people who buy fish.

It's your words, not my spin, that said your fish are sitting in tanks not selling - check your post cos I did, as you suggested. You can disagree all you want with my take on how to improve interest in cichlids, but in the real world there are others selling cichlids and other fish and making a profit in Perth. You said you were the only one. that's not my twist, they are your exact words and we've established it's not a true statement though for some reason certain people don't count. So if people are making a profit with their breeding and selling strategy and you or the retailers who got stuck with your fish can't sell your product that you've reportedly made significant investment in, I can't help but think you don't know how to breed and sell fish in a sustainable manner. You said I got you going but logic would dictate this conclusion and too bad if you don't like it - I am entitled to an opinion and I'm entitled to share it on here regardless of whether it meets your approval or not. I call it as I see it so maybe you should start being more careful with what you post and saying what you mean if you think I'm twisting your words. Getting you going is hardly a concern of mine and you can threaten me with a barrage of verbal warfare (these are your exact words again, not my twist) like you did Syd recently, but it won't shut me up or make me change my opinion. Perhaps you should be quiet if you can't handle a different opinion.

To explain to others why I'm making an issue - Myself and others on committee put a lot of thought and effort to try and promote interest in cichlids in Perth. We put our money where our mouths are too but don't go around talking about how good we are all the time. We are starting to see some positive signs and genuine interest in cichlids once again and I'm excited to see it even though it's still only small. But every time someone who feels they are superior to other hobbyists can't sell their fish for top dollar and then jump on here complaining Perth is shit and no one understands good fish, I see them successfully kill a little bit of the interest we have tried so hard to generate. I don't want to have these arguments as they are draining and Ive got better things to do, plus other committee are probably wanting me to be quiet and not stir up discontent. But guys we work too bloody hard to try and improve this hobby to let people come on here and shit all over what we are trying to do and contribute very little in return.

It's not true what is being said. the hobby in Perth is not shit or doomed, it just needs people to inspire some interest that was killed off with all this focus on generating profit.

My friend Mattia is generating interest in cichlids by organising German imports and sharing his experiences diving in the lakes. My friend Ronny has agreed to come back on the forum thankfully and will inspire others with stories of his fish keeping cos IMO he is a true superior fish keeper. Sandgroper made an effort to bring his show male wild peacock last night to a meeting and newcomers were standing around a tank asking questions about it. Rov just auctioned off 10 Multies for $100 on a cold winters night in front of 30 people. These are real life examples that demonstrate interest in cichlids - all you need to do is make an effort to share passion genuinely and people will be interested because cichlids are interesting. You can build a thriving hobby and market from this type of interest as we once had but everyone needs a stake, not just one major breeder wanting to dictate terms to a small market. Telling people that things are shit or no one understands how to keep fish properly or can identify quality fish is a sure fire way to kill interest so I really despise such comments when they are made and will react to them on occasion.

I know this a soapbox moment and they'll be plenty of disagreement with what I've just said. But can I challenge anyone who is going to respond to start by answering this question.

How is it that the PCS can raise almost $2k for cichlid conservation in Africa in less than a year if there is no interest in African cichlids?

[Mattia]

Just a correction, we raised over $4k AUD for cichlid preservation in Africa

[Buccal]

Yeah whatever Buccal. You'll keep going as long as I do but there's a limit to how much crap I can see posted before I react. Apologies to others that get tired of it but when I receive numerous pm's saying good on you for calling bullshit, I'm encouraged to respond. The alternative is to leave the crap up uncontested and risk people believing it. To those that are over it already, I'm sorry but I will shut up after this one, I promise.
Buccal If you understood markets then you'd understand what your market wants to buy. Economics 101 - Its where you should start if wanting to play in that game and I'm not a stranger to it despite what you imply. I just don't need to promote my experience or knowledge ad nauseum to feel credible. I maintain a good insight on what the market wants because at least once per month I go out and meet people who are the market and speak to them about what they're interested in. It provides a great insight. Ever watch Ramsey kitchen nightmares? He tells restuaranteurs to get out and ask their market what they want. When they do, they start to see how to adapt their business. You stopped trading privately and said something about not having time to chat and trade your fish. Get out and listen to newbies rather than preach to them on a forum if you want to be seen as credible when it comes to knowing the market. I think you are the one being audacious by implying I have little understanding of the matter because I do listen to a number of fellow fish keepers which are the market. Selling fat Malawi males for $300 for 6 - happy to be proved wrong but sounds like a dud to me based on my numerous conversations with people who buy fish.
It's your words, not my spin, that said your fish are sitting in tanks not selling - check your post cos I did, as you suggested. You can disagree all you want with my take on how to improve interest in cichlids, but in the real world there are others selling cichlids and other fish and making a profit in Perth. You said you were the only one. that's not my twist, they are your exact words and we've established it's not a true statement though for some reason certain people don't count. So if people are making a profit with their breeding and selling strategy and you or the retailers who got stuck with your fish can't sell your product that you've reportedly made significant investment in, I can't help but think you don't know how to breed and sell fish in a sustainable manner. You said I got you going but logic would dictate this conclusion and too bad if you don't like it - I am entitled to an opinion and I'm entitled to share it on here regardless of whether it meets your approval or not. I call it as I see it so maybe you should start being more careful with what you post and saying what you mean if you think I'm twisting your words. Getting you going is hardly a concern of mine and you can threaten me with a barrage of verbal warfare (these are your exact words again, not my twist) like you did Syd recently, but it won't shut me up or make me change my opinion. Perhaps you should be quiet if you can't handle a different opinion.
To explain to others why I'm making an issue - Myself and others on committee put a lot of thought and effort to try and promote interest in cichlids in Perth. We put our money where our mouths are too but don't go around talking about how good we are all the time. We are starting to see some positive signs and genuine interest in cichlids once again and I'm excited to see it even though it's still only small. But every time someone who feels they are superior to other hobbyists can't sell their fish for top dollar and then jump on here complaining Perth is shit and no one understands good fish, I see them successfully kill a little bit of the interest we have tried so hard to generate. I don't want to have these arguments as they are draining and Ive got better things to do, plus other committee are probably wanting me to be quiet and not stir up discontent. But guys we work too bloody hard to try and improve this hobby to let people come on here and shit all over what we are trying to do and contribute very little in return.
It's not true what is being said. the hobby in Perth is not shit or doomed, it just needs people to inspire some interest that was killed off with all this focus on generating profit.
My friend Mattia is generating interest in cichlids by organising German imports and sharing his experiences diving in the lakes. My friend Ronny has agreed to come back on the forum thankfully and will inspire others with stories of his fish keeping cos IMO he is a true superior fish keeper. Sandgroper made an effort to bring his show male wild peacock last night to a meeting and newcomers were standing around a tank asking questions about it. Rov just auctioned off 10 Multies for $100 on a cold winters night in front of 30 people. These are real life examples that demonstrate interest in cichlids - all you need to do is make an effort to share passion genuinely and people will be interested because cichlids are interesting. You can build a thriving hobby and market from this type of interest as we once had but everyone needs a stake, not just one major breeder wanting to dictate terms to a small market. Telling people that things are shit or no one understands how to keep fish properly or can identify quality fish is a sure fire way to kill interest so I really despise such comments when they are made and will react to them on occasion.
I know this a soapbox moment and they'll be plenty of disagreement with what I've just said. But can I challenge anyone who is going to respond to start by answering this question.
How is it that the PCS can raise almost $2k for cichlid conservation in Africa in less than a year if there is no interest in African cichlids?

yeah, ok then.

[Westie]

I believe that fish is a West Coast Eagles supporter

To those that are over it already, I'm sorry but I will shut up after this one, I promise.

 

I'll hold you to that promise  now have a guess at that fish will ya!

[Poncho]

Looks like a tropheops species from the shape of the mouth but that could be just the angle

[mac]

There we go, this was the fish in the previous photo:<br /><br />Should be easy from this view <br /><br />

Any chance we can resolve this one. I was hoping I may have got one right

[Mattia]

Whoops, forgot about it!

Tropheops Sp "Maleri yellow", it's found in all 3 the Maleri islands, and it has also a full blue male variant which is stunning!!

Google it as Tropheops sp. Maleri blue

Here is another cool fish, picture taken at Otter Island (or aka Otter point)

There were lots of males in breeding colors...

[Link2Hell]

Hemitilapia oxyrhynchus

Edited by Link2Hell, 12 July 2016 - 10:59 AM.

[Spiesie]

Otopharynx Heterodon