31 replies to this topic

[Mr_docfish]

I am surprised at the number of people that concerned about large wster changes..

If you use a suitable water conditioner (or better still have a reservoir of treated water to use) and the water parameters are similar to the tank at the time (salinity and pH) then there is no problem with doing even a full water change.

Of the water quality is poor in the aquarium, any other form of water would be better - so when it comes to sorting out a problem short term, big water changes to dilute to problem is always the best solution.

Once things settle down, then getting back to stability by doing 20/30% water changes are in order...

BUT always consider to problem at hand - if ammonia is the issue, then condition the water to keep the pH under 7.0 if you can, otherwise use an ammonia binder like ammolock or prime
If the tank has nitrite issues, them condition the water with extra salt/rift lake salt to prevent the uptake of nitrite via the gills...

Feel free to ask me if you have concerns over big water changes in particular situations... Most of the time it is better than leaving the fish in poor conditions...

[fishking123]

i do 40-50% wc weekly so 50% is fine.. my first thing i do is a water change..

[Buccal]

I believe a 50% water change is ok to, but there would be a low percentage of beneficial bacteria effected,,, they repopulate bloody fast though.
One thing to keep in mind though when doing 50% water changes,, is that as we get into cold weather, a water change this much will drop the water temp very low, especially if done late afternoon or at night.
Your heater may work over time also.
More water changes and less percentage at a time for winter.
Don't forget to put your heaters on people within the next week if not yet on.
Majority of people water change straight from tap with conditioners as a added option.
I'm guessing that the PH of Stirlings tap water is 7.5.

Edited by Buccal, 29 April 2013 - 09:25 PM.

[jjm66smokey]

Yep pretty close to 7.5.
I usually use the filtered water tap because the chlorine levels are a lot less noticeable
Always use either API Stress Coat or API Tap water conditioner.

[bigjohnnofish]

filtered tap water is something im not a fan off... although it takes out chlorine it tends to remove a lot of essential dissolved salts that your fish need... much like using rain water/RO water long term....

one point i'd like to raise also is the amount of ammonia present in your tap water... you could be changing out a fair bit of ammonia... but your introducing a fair bit too.... this ammonia level can vary so much from where you are to the time of day you fill your tank....

by using prime - it binds up the ammonia (and nitrites/nitrates at high levels)... but has a release period of 24-48hrs... meaning the bond it formed is broken back down... so this ammonia is slowly released back into your water... which serves the purpose of feeding your bacteria... but if your bacteria hasnt reproduced into sufficient numbers to cope with your ammonia load then it stays in your water... hence ammonia level can go back up.... and why retreating with prime and continued testing for ammonia is needed until bacteria numbers are big enough to cope with ammonia load...

as i said before expect a lot of your fish that are still alive to die within a few weeks as their gills etc may have been badly ammonia burnt beyond healing/recovery.....

andrew your ammonia nitrogen table is misleading to me.... so at 28 degrees and at a ph of 7.0 it isnt toxic to fish until it gets to 2.9ppm... if that happened in my tank there wouldnt be a single bristlenose alive... 0.1ppm bristlenose fry get damaged and die within week(s).... i think you need some further explanation to go with that table... as people are going to get the wrong idea.....

[Buccal]

I think the table applies to farming fish of particular classified species,, and actual grow out conditions.
A lot of farmed fish are not only chosen for edibility but for hardiness also.
Ornamental fish have numerous requirements that do not fit those criteria.
Ammonia from the tap would be a pain in the bum I'd imagine, having to test with liquid indicaters all the time.
Maybe a few packs of those quick test litmus paper strips,,,, not as accurate as liquid tester, but good for notification if ammonia is at all present.

[bigjohnnofish]

hey mark you would be amazed at what levels of ammonia i have gotten testing at times.... from 0 to over 5ppm of ammonia.... hence why now i try to make a habit of testing regularly... filling water storage tank is good as one test is sufficient to fill 20 odd tanks... but it has regularly been at 1ppm lately... but i wont get complacent as when i do bang heres 5ppm of ammonia for your filtration to try and cope with...

lost 1000's of little b/n fry last time it happened

so i wouldnt be using that table to go off to keep fish safe... only safe level of ammonia is "ZERO" ......

[jjm66smokey]

Zero Ammonia.
Yep that's what I'm heading back to.
Thanks for the advice
Water changes of 50% Sunday (with Prime + AmmoLock), 20% Monday (with Prime) have brought it down under 0.25 so nearly down to 0;
Another 50% tonight (with Prime) so will test in the morning;
Is there a better (not cost prohibitive) way you'd recommend to test than with API Colour Chart?

Tossed the old carbon in one filter tray and replaced with Aquaclay.
Cleared out the last dead fish and any organic material I could siphon, scoop, or prune.

What next please?

[Buccal]

hey mark you would be amazed at what levels of ammonia i have gotten testing at times.... from 0 to over 5ppm of ammonia.... hence why now i try to make a habit of testing regularly... filling water storage tank is good as one test is sufficient to fill 20 odd tanks... but it has regularly been at 1ppm lately... but i wont get complacent as when i do bang heres 5ppm of ammonia for your filtration to try and cope with...

lost 1000's of little b/n fry last time it happened

so i wouldnt be using that table to go off to keep fish safe... only safe level of ammonia is "ZERO" ......

Jeez, I wonder what impact there is on human consumption of water with ammonia levels at regular intake,,,,, maybe nothing,, maybe not.
Yeah I think with ammonia levels in a aquarium,,, really only got 1-2hours of exposure to the fish before they succumb to the effects.
I believe anyway.

[Buccal]

Keep your fish skinny and a little underfed to reduce waiste and let bio-media in filter colonize again before bio-load increases.
Try not to clean your filter to often,, keep up weekly water changes.
Wait till water flow reduces out the filter outlets as a indicator for cleaning.
Always clean in tank water in a bucket,,, and making sure the filter media is only exposed to the air for no longer than 5-10 seconds till submersed in tank water again,,, this will limit beneficial bacteria depletion.
If you don't over feed and keep above regime in place as well as maintaining temp at no less than 24'c ,, there is really no need for testing.
Im quite sure the saga that Johnno goes through with ammo tap water is his location.
I haven't tested my display tank for anything for well over 3 years.
Sometimes paranoia can contribute to wrong doings also.

[jjm66smokey]

Bioload in the display tank fairly low

- all the guys that moved into the 3ft guppy tank last week doing fine.

 

But the water in the display tank's still a bit cloudy

and the plants are looking a little rough.

 

20% daily water changes; with Prime to get the chlorine / ammonia out plus Seachem neutral regulator to try and bring pH down a little from 7.5

 

Ammonia on API test shows closer to 0ppm than 0.25 so it must be around 0.1

Nitrite appears to be zero

Nitrate around 40.

Gosh it's taking it's time.

 

Isn't there an easier way to do all this ???

Edited by jjm66smokey, 05 May 2013 - 12:55 AM.

[Buccal]

The water changes all the time strings it all out.
It rebalances a lot quicker if it's just left.
Obviously it's more uncomfortable/poisonous to your fish though,,, short term.